If Oz was as responsible in his touting of TM as he is of other herbs, drugs 
and procedures where he gives both the pros and cons, he would be giving both 
sides.

In fairness, he may not know the crap the TMO does, and he certainly may not 
know what Marshy was.




________________________________
 From: seventhray27 <steve.sun...@yahoo.com>
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2013 7:49 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back to Carol
 

  

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Carol" <jchwelch@...> wrote:
>
> Does Dr. Oz endorse TM specifically or does he endorse meditation in general? 
> 
> I have never watched Dr. Oz's show, but the other week I chanced upon him as 
> I was channel surfing. He stated something to the effect that if anyone ever 
> says he endorses a product, to please not believe that he endorses that said 
> product. (The context was in regard to weight loss.) He stated he makes a 
> point to not endorse products even though various products will claim he 
> endorses them. 
> 
> So...I'm just wondering if he really does endorse TM, or rather does he 
> endorse meditation (in any form) in general and that his choice of meditation 
> (at this point in his life) is TM?
> 
> Share stated, "[...] can all these smart and creative people be so deluded 
> about the efficacy of TM? [...]"
> 
> Apparently, TM works for
 them. That isn't a delusion; it is their reality. That said, they may be 
deluded (fooled or ignorant) or choose to be complacent regarding the TMO and 
its colored history; or maybe that just don't have the energy/time to learn 
about it. 

I guess you conveniently forgot the point that Share made, that perhaps they 
embrace the positive aspects of the technique, and feel that those positive 
aspects outweigh the negative parts of the organization.  Sorry if that skews 
your preconceived notions.
 
> Smart and creative people tout other practices/beliefs/products too. I don't 
> think they are deluded, but rather that they like said product/practice. That 
> doesn't mean I or the next person will like said product/practice. I may even 
> have a horrible experience with the said product/practice. Hopefully I am 
> somewhat smart and creative. 
> 
> I am suspicious when anyone pushes anything as the one true technique to 
> bring peace and resolution and absolute health to humanity. I'm not saying 
> any celebrities push TM as such; I don't keep up with that sort of 
> information. 
> 
> As far as Micheal and any of his issues, I think he is the authority on that 
> and he can decide to share or not to share. I have no desire to scrutinize 
> his (or anyone's) issues publicly or even privately. (I'm not saying you want 
> to do that either.)I have enough on my issue plate already.
> 
> Thanks for the response!
> 
>
 Gekkos are cool. 
> 
> And so is this beetle dude/dudette...Chrysolina cerealis
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=477780895608805&set=a.260816317305265.74666.187139094672988&type=1
> *************
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long sharelong60@ wrote:
> >
> > Hi Carol, my Mom loves the gekko too.  Of course the fact that Dr. Oz 
> > practices TM doesn't negate MJ's bad experiences with it.  Just as Fr 
> > Keating's Batgap interview does not negate my somewhat bad experiences with 
> > the Catholic Church.  But again, I'm not continuing to speak against 
> > Catholicism, etc.  Whereas Michael does continue to speak against TM, etc. 
> > and seems to have quite a charge when he does so.  From my own experience 
> > with charges, I'd say there's a deeper issue going on that just what 
> > appears on the surface.  
> > 
> > Just
 yesterday Michael expressed the wish that Dr. Oz who seems pretty savvy to me, 
stop being deluded about TMO.  This was in addition to saying that Dr. Oz is 
afraid to disagree with Oprah.  This latter statement especially indicates to 
me that there's a deeper issue present.  I've got my issues too so I'm not 
saying it's a bad thing.  But I give less weight to what someone says if it 
seems to me that there are other deeper issues present.  And I realize when 
people are overly positive, that too can indicate a deeper issue present.  If 
someone's energy feels off in either direction, then I take their opinions with 
a bigger grain of salt.
> > 
> > So I have been asking:  can all these smart and creative people be so 
> > deluded about the efficacy of TM?  Maybe they simply choose to use what's 
> > useful about it and leave the rest.
> > 
> > 
> > I doubt that Dr. Oz,
 who seems to me to have integrity, endorses TM only because he was asked to do 
so.  If indeed that is how it happened.  Maybe he approached them.  Maybe he 
had good experiences and liked what the research said, etc. and decided he 
wanted to share something valuable with others.  I think most people want to 
help others.  Then it's up to others to figure out whose opinion can actually 
be helpful to them.
> > Thanks for taking the time to reply.  
> > 
> > 
> > ________________________________
> > From: Carol jchwelch@
> > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 9:48 PM
> > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back to Michael and Carol
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > Share stated: 
> > "Hi Carol, the crucial difference is that I don't continually have or 
> > express
 negative opinions about Christianity, Christian churches or Jesus Christ. So 
there is nothing for me to reconcile. I can easily believe that a smart, 
successful and healthy person might practice Christianity."
> > 
> > Good point. 
> > 
> > I'm around some folks who regularly do criticize Christianity and belief in 
> > God(s). For me that's where the comparison comes in between Collins and 
> > Christianity with Dr. Oz and TM. Sorry I wasn't clear about that. :)
> > 
> > What is there to reconcile with Oz and TM? I don't get what needs to be 
> > reconciled.
> > 
> > Just because Dr. Oz (or anyone else) likes and practices TM and touts its 
> > benefits doesn't negate another person's bad or toxic experiences with TM 
> > or the TMO.
> > 
> > Of course, any business/corporation likes to have well known folks endorse 
> > them. Sells more product, practice, whatever the goods are. Dr. Oz's
 endorsement of TM and the TMO (if he does endorse them) is good PR for the TMO.
> > 
> > The gekko endorses Geiko. And then there's Flo for Progressive. But I'm 
> > still with Nationwide; I like my agent and the service. 
> > 
> > **********
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long wrote:
> > >
> > > Thanks for your reply Michael.  Just a couple of points:
> > > I don't know that Dr. Oz is unwilling to disagree with Oprah.  Do you 
> > > know that for a fact?  He seems pretty independent to me.
> > > 
> > > I don't know enough about mantras to comment on that.  And I don't 
> > > think TM is superior because anyone said so.  I think it is unique in 
> > > the effortlessness of it process.  My own logic tells me that this 
> > > effortlessness is what makes it the best meditation
 technique that I know of.  I am happy with it so don't feel compelled to 
look for another.
> > > 
> > > Hi Carol, the crucial difference is that I don't continually have or 
> > > express negative opinions about Christianity, Christian churches or Jesus 
> > > Christ.  So there is nothing for me to reconcile.  I can easily 
> > > believe that a smart, successful and healthy person might practice 
> > > Christianity.  
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Michael Jackson 
> > > To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 5:55 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back to Michael
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > Let's see - there are a whole bunch of
 people who practice and tout TM who could variously be characterized as Bliss 
Ninny's and other such names, I should start TM again because he agrees with 
them? 
> > > 
> > > Should I take his word for it when he agrees with, hmmm let's see, the 
> > > German Purusha guys I have read about here on FFL who wear swastikas 
> > > under their ties and party when it is Hitler's birthday?
> > > 
> > > Or should I continue to
> > > chart my own course? The bottom line answer to your question is six fold, 
> > > Shary. 
> > > 
> > > One - I am confident enough in my own experience and ability to decide 
> > > things
> > > for myself that I do not suddenly reverse course on the word of a 
> > > celebrity who owes his fame to Oprah and is unwilling to disagree with 
> > > her. 
> > > 
> > > Two - I agree he is intelligent and the fact that he thinks TM is a good 
> > > thing, I don't hold
 against
> > > him. 
> > > One day I trust he will come out of that particular delusion.
> > > 
> > > Three - Other intelligent people, like me, were deluded by Marshy and TM 
> > > sales pitches, cuz that is exactly what they have always been, sales 
> > > pitches. Therefore I don't hold it against him that he too is deluded 
> > > about TM.
> > > 
> > > Four - This is speculation, but I do not believe he has the benefit of 
> > > the experiences of seeing some of the things I have seen in TM - abusive 
> > > behavior on the part of TM longtimers especially the popinjay Governors 
> > > with a little bit of TM authority and the unstressing phenomenon, 
> > > particularly that seen on long rounding courses. Were he aware of these 
> > > things, I trust he would be intelligent enough to alter his opinion of TM 
> > > and its pimps.
> > > 
> > > Five - He is unaware the TMO treats himself and all TM celebrities far
 differently than they treat rank and file meditators, sidhas and Governors who 
have no money, celebrity or TM authority within the Movement. 
> > > 
> > > As
> > > an aside, I must admit that the TMO is an equal opportunity abuser. 
> > > Those donkeys will abuse anyone whom they think they have authority over, 
> > > be they meditators or Governors. 
> > > 
> > > The difference in treatment of celebrities and money people on the one 
> > > hand and regular folks on the other were he to see it, I am sure his 
> > > magnificent intelligence would enable him to question the efficacy of TM.
> > > 
> > > Six - I agree that the simple practice of TM itself can make one feel 
> > > refreshed and rested under the right circumstances (i.e. - the TM 
> > > meditator generally has to have had a good night's sleep the night 
> > > before, can't be hung over, kapha, pitta and vata has to be balanced just 
> > > right,
 has to sleep in a vastu ved house, had the proper amount of Amrit Kalash upon 
arising, had the proper amount of yagyas done that month, but only by a 
certified Marshy pundit) with all those parameters being met, one can feel good 
after TM.
> > > 
> > > But this does not happen
> > > because there is something special about TM
> > > itself,
> > > contrary to what Bobby Roth, David Lynch, Johnnie Hagelin and all the 
> > > other TM pimps claim. It happens because Pure Awareness is natural and we 
> > > connect with it, we are it, every minute of every day. Just settling in 
> > > and getting quiet or using other mantras or following the breath will do 
> > > it. TM people believe TM is superior for one reason - because Marshy said 
> > > it was. For TM to be superior, there would have to be something about the 
> > > TM mantras that is superior and there is not. If you believe the TM 
> > > mantras are superior tell me how? If it isn't that TM
 mantras that are superior, then what is it that makes TM superior?
> > > 
> > > So given the fact that I know TM is not superior to any other way of 
> > > being myself I am not stupid enough to change my life based on Mehmet 
> > > Oz's incorrect assumptions and TM delusions that I have already cured 
> > > myself of. So there is your answer Share. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Share Long 
> > > To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 2:06 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back to Michael
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > Well it makes it grosser.  But grosser is not plainer.  And it has
 nothing to do with taking the word of a famous, rich person.  It has to do 
with taking the word of an intelligent, independent person who also happens to 
be rich and famous.  That's what you keep avoiding, isn't it?  That Dr. 
Oz is smart and completely independent of TMO.  I'm guessing that's really 
what you can't reconcile with all your beliefs about TM.  That someone 
really smart and successful and knowledgeable about health would choose to 
practice it.    
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Michael Jackson 
> > > To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 12:18 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back to Michael
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > Why should I take his word because he has money and fame? That is a 
> > > bullshit premise from the get go. Does that make it any plainer?
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Share Long 
> > > To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 12:49 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back to Michael
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > What I notice is how you evade the real point.  Which I'll elucidate 
> > > by saying that I don't consider The Donald as healthy.  So again, if 
> > > you are able, how do you explain that someone like Dr. Oz, smart, 
> > > successful and healthy, practices and promotes
 TM?
> > > 
> > > I'm also noticing that none of the anti TM people can answer this one. 
> > >  And so they are evading it.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Michael Jackson 
> > > To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com" FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 11:28 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back to Emily and Michael
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > I don't take the amount of money or fame someone has as an edict to do 
> > > what they recommend. If I did, I would have Donal Trump as my guru
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Share Long 
> > > To: "FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com"
 FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2013 5:10 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back to Emily and Michael
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > Michael, I'm genuinely curious:  how do you reconcile all that you 
> > > believe about TM with the fact that someone as smart and 
> > > successful and healthy as Dr. Oz practices TM and endorses it?  I'm 
> > > thinking that for famous people like Lynch and Paul McCartney, Howard 
> > > Stern and Seinfeld, etc. they're just grateful to have found a technique 
> > > that enables them to not only survive but thrive in the very demanding 
> > > entertainment field.  
> > > 
> > > PS to Emily, thanks for your reply smile.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ________________________________
> >
 > From: salyavin808 
> > > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > > Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2013 3:40 PM
> > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Is Back
> > > 
> > > 
> > >   
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck" wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" wrote:
> > > > >
> > > 
> > > > > How about Jack Forem? He just got added at the top.
> > > > > 
> > > > >
> > > > 
> > > > From NYTimes page:
> > > > Jack Forem Boise, Idaho
> > > > "I recently released an updated version of a book on TM written in the 
> > > > 1970s. I thought the update would take me a couple of months, but the 
> > > > process of sorting
 through the vast amount of published, top-quality, peer-reviewed scientific 
research, and the number of compassionate and helpful programs such as those 
cited in the article on David Lynch's foundation, kept me engaged in research 
and writing for two years. I have practiced TM since 1967, taught it, and 
helped to train TM teachers. Yet I must say I was overwhelmed â€" and I do 
not use that word lightly â€" by the extent and depth of the benefits I 
uncovered in my research. From greatly improved health, better educational 
outcomes, stress reduction, and the awakening to higher states of 
consciousness, to replicated interventions in war-torn areas that resulted in 
calm and peace, the benefits of TM are thoroughly demonstrated and truly 
extraordinary. I find it sad that some misinformed
> > and/or
> > > angry people find it necessary to attack such a good thing, that has 
> > > helped, and is helping, so many. I would urge
 them to investigate more deeply and re-think their position."
> > > > 
> > > > http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/magazine/david-lynch-transcendental-meditation.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&;
> > > 
> > > But all of these angry people are TMers for whom it didn't work
> > > or who got fed up with the way the organisation operated after 
> > > working there for years and thus can't really be said to be misinformed.
> > > 
> > > But their story was somehow neglected from his research?
> > >
> >
>

 

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