--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, doctordumbass@... <no_reply@...> wrote: > > You blew it - There is a phenomenon you've probably heard of in long distance > running, called, "hitting the wall". It means reaching a point of physical > depletion, after 15 or so miles, so that the only thing carrying you forward > is your knowledge that it is a temporary phase, that can be transcended. But > if you are not confident, this is the end of the journey. > > TM is all about continuing to run through imagined walls. Too bad you and Bee > are quitters. Now, neither of you will ever know about the eternal benefits > of TM. Maybe you should've hung in there a little longer?
Hmm, you seem to have found yourself a perfect, if ridiculous, way to claim to have won any argument about TM: "You only did it for 20 years! What do you know!" Doesn't make much of an advertising slogan though: TM - twenty years of running through walls.... > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson <mjackson74@> wrote: > > > > you are an idiot - I did TM for 20 years, twice a day, every day - it took > > me that long to realize it wasn't the only game in town - stupid me. > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: "doctordumbass@" <doctordumbass@> > > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Wednesday, March 6, 2013 9:04 AM > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Question for TM Cheerleaders > > > > > > Â > > The only people I see repeating what they were TOLD are you and MJ, > > repeating over and over again, what you TELL yourselves. The thing you > > haven't recognized about TM, *since you don't do it*, is that the practice > > keeps you moving. > > > > TM is not the static believerism you make it out to be. You have NO IDEA > > about the techniques' long term effects because you quit doing it, decades > > ago. > > > > So you can fart into the wind all you like, exhorting us all about what TM > > is and isn't. But you are nothing but a quitter sitting on the sidelines > > bitching about it, in my humble opinion. > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb wrote: > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb wrote: > > > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, navashok wrote: > > > > > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > My point is that a lot of these discussions are, from > > > > > > my point of view, falling prey to one of the most > > > > > > chronic TM fallacies. People repeat stuff they were > > > > > > TOLD -- by the people selling them the technique -- > > > > > > as if it were not only true, but cosmically true, > > > > > > Gospel Truth. They consider these things Truth so > > > > > > strongly that they *assume* them, parrot them along > > > > > > without even *noticing* the assumption, and then base > > > > > > other, subsequent statements on them as if the Truth > > > > > > of the assumptions was a given. > > > > > > > > > > Now that's something I noticed, that the theories and the > > > > > mindset created continues way after a person actually > > > > > leaves TM. If you were let's say 10 years in TM, your > > > > > belief system will be influenced still decades after > > > > > you left it - not all of the beliefs, but enough for you > > > > > to still uncover it, if you are interested in it. > > > > > > > > And if you are interested in challenging their supposed > > > > truth or value. In my experience, it's these "core" or > > > > *never challenged* beliefs that persist the longest, and > > > > are toughest to either recognize or challenge. Stuff like > > > > *assuming* that "effortless is better," or that "the only > > > > way to transcend is via effortlessness." People have been > > > > repeating that meme for so long -- in most cases *without > > > > ever trying a technique not based on effortlessness to > > > > see if it's really true* -- that they no longer realize > > > > that it's a fundamental belief that underlies and shapes > > > > all other beliefs they have about meditation in general, > > > > and sometimes about life itself. > > > > > > A poignant example of this, related to me by at least > > > half a different spiritual teachers from traditions > > > other than TM, has to do with what long-term TMers > > > come to their public introductory talks. Often a tech- > > > nique of meditation is taught, and of course they sit > > > there and look as if they're trying it, just like > > > everyone else in the audience. > > > > > > But all of these teachers have related the same story > > > to me. Some of these TMers actually come up to them > > > later and ask to meet with them privately, because > > > they're interested in attending more talks, or study- > > > ing with them, often because they liked the overall > > > energy of the group or of the teacher, or liked the > > > things he or she talked about. > > > > > > What these teachers have learned to do, out of long > > > experience, is to ask the former TMers, "When we > > > practiced the meditation I was teaching, did you > > > actually *try* it, or did you sit there doing TM? > > > Be scrupulously honest now." > > > > > > In *most* cases, when dealing with former TMers, they > > > admit that they never *did* try the new technique of > > > meditation. Some admit that some part of them still > > > felt "guilty" about trying it, as if doing so were > > > somehow "wrong" or "sinful," and others admitted to > > > not having tried it because "they already knew how > > > to meditate." > > > > > > Most of these teachers at this point asked the person > > > applying to study with them to go away, and return > > > when they had regained the ability to achieve > > > "Beginner's Mind," and approach a new study with > > > humility, and not with arrogance. Few ever did. > > > > > > > > If you discover that Maharishi was playing games with > > > > > beliefs, inventing stories to make people go along with > > > > > it, and then see how long it takes to get rid of it, it > > > > > makes you think. > > > > > > > > And it's a real *challenge*, both to identify these core > > > > beliefs, to challenge them when you do, and then to drop > > > > them if you find them not true or not valuable for you. > > > > This is more effort than most people who've invested for > > > > many years in a spiritual tradition are willing to expend. > > > > They pay "lip service" to having walked away, but *when* > > > > they walk away, they do so still carrying years of indoc- > > > > trination and beliefs as baggage. > > > > > > > > > But OTOH, if you REALLY transcend, if you really go ahead > > > > > in your experience, it will also explode most of those > > > > > beliefs. > > > > > > > > For some. For others, they find a way *after* the trans- > > > > cendent experience to interpret it in hindsight as > > > > reaffirming the things they believed before. > > > > > > > > > That is why those who really get into a higher state of > > > > > consciousness, usually can't stay in the movement for > > > > > very long. The beliefs and indoctrination is for those > > > > > without experiences. > > > > > > > > Can't argue with that. How you gonna keep 'em down on > > > > the farm after they've seen Par-eee? Don't ever allow > > > > them to see Par-eee. :-) > > > > > > > > > >
