yea, so what?
 

________________________________
 From: "s3raph...@yahoo.com" <s3raph...@yahoo.com>
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Mitchell Kapor
  
   
 
I don't know if it's been mentioned on this thread already but one vital point 
Kapor makes about his time on the six-month sidhi course is that he felt he and 
the other participants were being used as "experimental subjects". That charge 
carries weight, doesn't it? These early learners were the guinea pigs for the 
TMO developing its course material. 
--- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, <mjackson74@...> wrote
I would be surprised if going to this event was OK with the Guardians of the 
Doors to the Domes.

 

________________________________
 From: "dhamiltony2k5@..." <dhamiltony2k5@...>
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 10:14 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] RE: Re: Mitchell Kapor
  
  
 Yeah, the poor aggravated guy.  Of
course we know a lot more now than we did then.  I was on that course
too and it wasn't so bad.  It was great actually.  Would be good now
to also hook someone like that up with a little vipassanaic practice
along with the transcendence and then also cultivating more with that
part in the checking notes about feeling in to the body more.  That
could all be very helpful to anyone going through their time of
acedia.  For instance this person, http://www.timeportalpubs.com/has long been 
very helpful these ways to the meditating
community these ways.  The waking down community here, 
https://sites.google.com/site/wakingdowninfairfield/ has been very helpful 
these ways too for people who suffer this way. Of course you guys left the 
movement long before what it is now as
a meditating community. 
-Buck   

> 
>>> Kapor evidently gets angry and
>leaves everything. Story 
>> of his life evidently. And, you are using him as a witness 
>> against something? You are cherry picking. Did you 
>> actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer 
>> on his interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just 
>> interviewed a psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This 
>> guy Kapor sounds predisposed in life to have problems 
>> where ever he goes. 20 minutes twice a day of meditation 
>> with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough for 
>> him.
>
>
>Turq writes;
>Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfectas course leaders 
>of long residence courses back then. What-ever course participants complain of 
>-- *whatever* it is -- itcan be cured by pranayama and more (or less) TM. And 
>I understand. Back when I worked at the Regional Office,I was such a TB that 
>the implications of how we were runningthose courses never occurred to me. We 
>never -- NEVER -- gaveany thought to what we'd do if something serious came up 
>onone of our courses. We had no liability insurance, no doctorson call, and no 
>list of what the course leaders should actually*do* if someone started 
>"heavily unstressing," other than theaforementioned "more (or less) TM and 
>pranayma." Maybe more asanas. And definitely a checking. Everyone knows thata 
>TM checking can cure anything. In retrospect we were incredibly naive, and 
>dangerously so.But we had all bought into that core dogma thang -- "TM is100% 
>life-supporting." We didn't have to
 plan for negativesituations because by definition on a course on which 
every-one was practicing TM nothing negative could ever happen.I suspect that 
some here will dispute this. I further suspectthat those doing so didn't spend 
much time on long roundingcourses, and by "long" I mean in excess of six weeks. 
Thoselong courses in Europe didn't have any liability or medicalinsurance, 
either, and they certainly didn't have a team ofreliable doctors on call. But 
of course there was no *need* for those things, because by definition on a TM 
course nothing bad could happen. The Laws Of Nature just wouldn't allow it. And 
if anything bad *did* happen, no problemo. Whatever it is, it can be cured with 
pranayama and more (or less) TM.Maybe a checking.  
>--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>Buck schticks (at least I hope it's schtick):
>
>> 
>>> Kapor evidently gets angry and leaves everything. Story 
>> of his life evidently. And, you are using
him as a witness 
>> against something? You are cherry picking. Did you 
>> actually read the Kapor interview through? Rick Archer 
>> on his
interview show about spirituality, Batgap.com just 
>> interviewed a
psychiatrist about this kind of thing. This 
>> guy Kapor sounds
predisposed in life to have problems 
>> where ever he goes. 20 minutes
twice a day of meditation 
>> with liberal pranayama should proly be good enough
for 
>> him.Buck, you (or your altered-state ego) would have been perfectas course 
>> leaders of long residence courses back then. What-ever course participants 
>> complain of -- *whatever* it is -- itcan be cured by pranayama and more (or 
>> less) TM. And I understand. Back when I worked at the Regional Office,I was 
>> such a TB that the implications of how we were runningthose courses never 
>> occurred to me. We never -- NEVER -- gaveany thought to what we'd do if 
>> something serious came up onone of our courses. We had no liability 
>> insurance, no doctorson call, and no list of what the course leaders should 
>> actually*do* if someone started "heavily unstressing," other than 
>> theaforementioned "more (or less) TM and pranayma." Maybe more asanas. And 
>> definitely a checking. Everyone knows thata TM checking can cure anything. 
>> In retrospect we were incredibly naive, and dangerously so.But we had all 
>> bought into that core dogma thang -- "TM is100% life-supporting." We didn't 
>> have to
 plan for negativesituations because by definition on a course on which 
every-one was practicing TM nothing negative could ever happen.I suspect that 
some here will dispute this. I further suspectthat those doing so didn't spend 
much time on long roundingcourses, and by "long" I mean in excess of six weeks. 
Thoselong courses in Europe didn't have any liability or medicalinsurance, 
either, and they certainly didn't have a team ofreliable doctors on call. But 
of course there was no *need* for those things, because by definition on a TM 
course nothing bad could happen. The Laws Of Nature just wouldn't allow it. And 
if anything bad *did* happen, no problemo. Whatever it is, it can be cured with 
pranayama and more (or less) TM.Maybe a checking. 
>--- In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, <mjackson74@...> wrote:
>>
>>that
 is an excellent description, Barry - I never thought of TM as a drug 
with side effects but I reckon that is what it is. Like a soma pill, 
with side efects!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>>________________________________
>> From: turquoiseb <no_re...@yahoogroups.com>
>>To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
>>Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 3:30 AM
>>Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Mitchell Kapor
>>  
>>
>>  
>>--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb <no_reply@...> wrote: > > 
>>--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson <mjackson74@> wrote: > 
>>> > > So during the course nothing substantive was done for  > > these folks? 
>>I mean beyond telling them to do more  > > asanas or something? >  > Depends 
>>on the course. On small ATR courses, no > nothing in particular was really 
>>done. On larger > courses, they might have been referred to one of > the 
>>resident quacks...uh...I mean doctors.  >  > But it was clear that no real 
>>effort was made to > help any of these people who were twitching  > 
>>uncontrollably or having symptoms that looked > for all the world like 
>>Tourette syndrome or  > worse, because the prevailing myth was always > "TM 
>>is 100% life supporting." No one was willing > to go up against that and add, 
>>"...for many  > people, but for others, it may cause problems." >  > Anyone I 
>>ever spoke to who was going through this > commented on the
 "Blame the victim" mentality they > were exposed to. It was always, "What are 
YOU  > doing wrong that this is happening to you? We > all 'know' that it 
'shouldn't' be happening."  Just to follow up, Michael, here's the essential 
conundrum posed by all of this. I worked for some time in the West Coast 
Regional Office of the TMO, arranging all the weekend and longer residence  
courses. On the one hand, we were told by MMY's core dogma that TM was "100% 
life supporting," and that it could not *possibly* have any negative  effects. 
Simply can't happen.   On the other hand, as part of what we did for the TMO, 
we were asked to tell the course leaders and  course participants that while 
they were on the course, they could not drive, they could not even leave the 
facility, on longer courses they could  not go anywhere even on the facility 
grounds unless  they were accompanied by their "buddy," and that they 
definitely shouldn't make any important decisions
 while they were on the course because their judgment might be impaired.   If a 
drug had that many admitted side effects, you wouldn't be able to sell it 
without a  prescription.                 
         

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