--- akasha_108 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> But your words are so much focussed on the
> subjective Experience "no
> I" that people seem to think that you are saying
> there is no genetic
> Peter, no social Peter, no Professional Peter. Which
> is silly. I know
> you don't mean that, but your words appear to some
> as so emphatic
> sometimes, the totality of the situation is not
> clear to evryone.
That must be the case. Saying "I" don't exist could be
a tad confusing for someone listening.
> Its like you "let go" of genetic Peter, social
> Peter, professional
> Peter. Or genetic Peter, social Peter, professional
> Peter let go of
> (their binding claim on) you. You let go. Only you
> didn't do anything.
> Its like "you got let go." Which is (in amerian
> idiom) "you got
> fired". You no longer work. Work happens but you are
> retired.
Not retired, but dead. Actually not, dead, but never
born. Like a dream character seen from waking state,
you just laugh and say, boy, what a nut, I thought I
was a tree! You never were a tree, never.
>
> This is a good point. "no I" is one story. Its one
> marker. Its one way
> to describe IT. There are other stories. 9 million
> in the Naked City
> alone. It appears you have some qualm about letting
> go and enjoying
> and celebratng other stories. it not clear why.
Arrogant bastard that I am? ;-)
> > I don't experience that as insulting. Passive
> > aggressive comments like, "hiding behind
> concepts,"
> > and "he doesn't bother to answer me." are
> indicative
> > of another agenda going on in the conversation.
>
> IMO, you are reading way to much into simple words,
> finding things
> that are "insulting" or "other agendas" (tom is into
> "seeing agendas"
> also. go figure) Why can't the words just be a
> story. Someones story
> about you. So many stories. What does one more
> matter. If they like
> their story, should that be enough? And who cares if
> someone is
> passive agressive. That is their issue. Something is
> bothering them.
> Why is that a crime?
No crime. Maybe its my profession. I'm very sensitive
to experiencing implicit psychological agendas. That's
what I get paid to do.
>
> (Its roughlyparallel to the fact that people have
> thoughts. Are the
> thoughts true? Maybe. maybe not. But its not a crime
> to have a
> thought, regardless of whether its true of not.)
>
>
> > > Why is he so attached to that story. "No
> > > I" is a story, a
> > > description by words of an inner state.
> >
> > Because the concept/story articulates my
> > phenomenological reality. I'm "attached " to it
> the
> > same way you'd be attached to the phrase, "It's
> > raining" if you went outside and rain drops were
> > falling from the sky.
>
> But its not the only "true" story.
Of course, and maybe that is where my fault lies in
that I usually ignore a posting if the thread takes a
turn towards something that holds no interest for me.
This is not meant to be a commentary upon the value of
the postings in the thread for others. Another problem
is that exchanging thoughts with more intelligent,
philosophical types such as Iremili and yourself
becomes extremely time consuming and difficult in this
medium. A live conversation would work much better
with instant feedback and more subtle, nuanced
explanations.
>
> > When the phenomenological
> > reality changes, then the concept will be useless.
> And
> > I understand that the phenomenological reality of
> no
> > "I" is useless to you.
>
> Its not all black and white. I read into Irmeli's
> words, over time,
> certanly some Experience. It seems a lot of the
> "debate" is semantics,
> you each previeve words of the other in ways
> different than they were
> meant.
I see that too and it becomes very tedious to attempt
to clarify all the mis-matching concepts so I leave
the conversation.
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