On 11/16/2014 5:47 AM, nablusoss1008 wrote:

Both the Turq's claim that he saw the Lenz-Rama-guy levitate many times

/Barry's reality is his perception, but he has no proof of his subjective experiences. How could he have any proof - it's all in his own subjective experience!

and Curti's claim that "knowledge is not different in different states of consciousness" loom over these two guys forever.

/Curtis meditates on his music probably all day and all night./

It's a good thing that Richard keep reminding every possible lurker here how far out of any possible self-insight these two guy's are.

/ The cognitive dissonance should seem pretty obvious, even to the casual reader. So, in fact there's no possible proof for Barry's subjective experiences and Curtis meditates most of the time and sings spirituals.

So, where's the problem talking about the contradictions? Go figure./

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <punditster@...> wrote :

On 11/15/2014 4:23 PM, nablusoss1008 wrote:

    Sal is adjusting his speak every day now. Watch out, one of these
    days he'll even retract his extremely silly judgements on the
    Crop Circles.

    "Adjusting his speak" - that's a good one! Apparently he already
    believes in tall tales - he has yet to reply to Barry's levitation
    claims about Rama. Go figure.

    /"And I don't just mean explaining things away, to be convincing
    you have to show that something more realistic happened, more
    credible and using explanations we already understand and are
    known to happen in certain circumstances."/ - salyavin808

    ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
    <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> <mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote :

    ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
    <mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com>, <sharelong60@...>
    <mailto:sharelong60@...> wrote :

    Salyavin, I love your last paragraph: folklore in action; techno
    ghost stories for the nuclear age. As for me, I believe there is
    life somewhere else in the vast universe. And I think they are
    more highly advanced than us and maybe here with us. And I think
    it's great.

    We can believe what we like. I have no opinion on intelligent
    life elsewhere, we don't know the variables that allow for it to
    develop. We could be unique or the universe could be teeming or
    maybe there's just one or two per galaxy over it's entire
    history. But the chances of there being other humanoids visiting
    Earth at the just same time as we've understood where we are
    cosmically? It beggars belief. Alien craft is the least likely
    explanation for UFO's. But I hope it's true.

    But at that point, I'm more like turq. It doesn't really impact
    my life one way or the other. Either way, what is the action
    step? (-:

    I don't know, just enjoy the ride, the evolving myth. We are
    apparently on the brink of something called "disclosure". We've
    been here before a few times as I recall, it never amounts to
    much but it's fun watching the TB's get excited that their
    favourite daydream is to be officially confirmed.

    But it won't be, the UFO's won't land and Maitreya won't appear.
    It's the way of things. The connection between the two is that
    people want there to be more, want there to be a reason and for
    there to be salvation from a higher power, whether it's alien or
    spiritual. We're talking deep human needs here.

    *From:* salyavin808 <no_re...@yahoogroups.com>
    *To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
    *Sent:* Saturday, November 15, 2014 3:06 PM
    *Subject:* [FairfieldLife] Re: Okay, let's put it on the table: UFOs

    ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
    <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> <mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote :

    Sal doesn't like UFO's because they aren't scientific :-)

    It's an interesting point Nabs. The thing is one can only get
    scientific about something if it is available to study, UFO's are
    so fleeting and ephemeral that there really isn't anything to
    study other than hearsay or suspiciously absent film taken by
    higher powers to keep the whole thing secret.

    But a great many people have studied what they can about UFO
    sightings, and done it with as much rigour as you can with such a
    paucity of hard evidence. I'm not sure there is an encounter that
    hasn't got a better explanation that doesn't involve us being
    visited by beings from another world. And I don't just mean
    explaining things away, to be convincing you have to show that
    something more realistic happened, more credible and using
    explanations we already understand and are known to happen in
    certain circumstances. Even testing soil damage and skin burns
    for alternative causes. People are being scientific about UFO's.

    But here's the thing you overlook in your quip, I've been
    interested in UFO's for as long as I remember, I've a got a shelf
    full of the classic books on the subject. Even the true believer
    stuff from "serious" researchers like Timothy Good and the
    abductionists like Bud Hopkins. I bet I know all the great
    encounters by heart - Cortile, Ramirez, Roswell, Pascagoula,
    Ilkley Moor, Rendlesham...

    I love it but I don't take it at face value. To me, UFO's are
    folklore in action. The evolving myth of abduction and what they
    are supposedly doing here are the legends of our time, a new
    religion, encapsulating our fears about technology and promising
    us freedom from our destructive ways, yet always remaining
    remarkably evidence free. There's always a new vision to add to
    the mythos but conveniently never any hard evidence to help
    decide one way or the other. And the longer that scenario goes on
    the more convinced any casual observer should be that we are
    kidding ourselves, because deep down we like ghost stories and
    that's really what they are. Something scary always just out of
    reach. Techno ghost stories for the nuclear age.

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    ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
    <mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com>, <steve.sundur@...>
    <mailto:steve.sundur@...> wrote :

    I didn't really read what sal has written below, but I think the
    gist of it is, that he doesn't like the person who coined the
    word "flying saucer"

    Is that what his dissertation is about this time?

    ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
    <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> <mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote :

    There is not one astronaut who has NOT reported seeing UFO's,
    sometimes huge and in large nubers, back to NASA and/or their

    ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
    <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> <mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote :

    ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
    <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> <mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote :

    If Gordon is not crazy, then the American government is
    purposefully, mindfully, ABSOLUTELY evil.

    If there are aliens visiting us and we're not being told -- it
    robs every person on Earth.


    Neither you, nor I, nor anyone ever could possibly be who we are
    now if we knew that UFOs are real.


    And that's why it might be kept a secret -- the concept "money"
    would be bereft of allure.

    If you say that it would NOT be "all that much of a big deal, cuz
    everyone's so inured already by Hollywood films," then YOU DON'T

    Every person in every way:  changed.

    Agreed. Luckily I don;t suppose it will come to that. Which is a
    shame as I'd be the happiest person on Earth if it turned out
    that UFO's were alien spacecraft, but the truth of sightings
    always turns out to be more mundane.

    Take the name "flying saucers", everyone sees saucer shaped craft
    but the name is a mistake from the first encounter anyone had.
    Kenneth Arnold (an experienced pilot) saw a squadron of highly
    reflective crescent shaped aircraft flying at great speed in a V
    formation over the Rocky mountains in 1947. He described them as
    flying like a saucer would if skipped across water.

    A journalist made up the name /flying saucer/ and after that
    everyone saw saucer shaped craft when they saw something
    mysterious in the sky. The power of suggestion. Sadly there's no
    such thing as a reliable witness and any one can be fooled,
    Arnold most likely saw a flock of pelicans and mistook them for
    unknown aircraft and miscalculated their distance from him. We
    all make mistakes but the influence his mistake had is immeasurable.

    Because we people are so unreliable, if I had to bet I would say
    that Cooper saw some atmospheric effect from flying at supersonic
    speed that no one had noticed before and mistook it for real
    craft moving above him.

    And early radar was hopelessly unreliable, the UK air defence
    system in the cold war was always telling us that giant UFOs were
    crossing the north sea but when planes were scrambled to look it
    turned out to have been temperature inversions confusing the
    equipment. When these anomalies were understood and ironed out
    UFO reports stopped coming in. It's the way it goes, people see
    stuff and imagination plugs any gaps, popular culture is rife
    with imagery that came before the sightings. I can't trust myself
    let alone anyone else!

    I would like to see this film they took though but, I don't
    suppose we ever will. That's the way

    (Message over 64 KB, truncated)

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