Stop describing any and all criticism, no matter how mild, as "character 
assassination," Doug. You've been the target of *real* character assassination; 
you ought to know better than to use the term when it's not warranted. 



 ---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 Actually these people, the maha teachers and the ‘ordinary spiritually 
awakening’ around here do agree with your prescription, Ollie. You would find 
them practical and real in life as you are teaching.  But to assume and 
castigate them as moodmakers seems just more ad hominem, character 
assassination and contending in place of consideration of what they are saying. 
 Yours may be a different ‘bandwidth’ than these illumined. 

 ---In, <olliesedwuz@...> wrote :

 Agreed. Also, if these 'spiritual teachers' are concerned about the effects of 
the astral world, they need to meditate and integrate their silence more. There 
is a natural momentum upwards towards sattva once sufficient sadhana is done. 
If the astral is still grasping or they are overly interested, it is from not 
enough purity in the system. The normal state is to not pay much attention to 
the astral world, in favor of the material and divine. Then we can be useful.


---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 Yep, maybe describes a societal agitation of a Trump in mass-media.  A 
difference is that these spiritual insights by contrast offer what can be used 
directly as a remediation to what is seen as a spiritual societal agitation in 
meditation, study, engaging socially to be of help to others.  Research of 
modern sciences [of the postmodern era] would seem to indicate some validity to 
what these modern spiritual people are observing in their satsang.

---In, <authfriend@...> wrote :

 I have to laugh and shake my head at this "commentary" because it sounds so 
much like Trump's "Be afraid, be very afraid" speech at the convention--not so 
much the specifics, but the "sky is falling" tone. I agree totally with Olllie; 
it's the silliest kind of moodmaking. And when it comes from spiritual 
teachers, they sound as if they're worried about competition. 



 ---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 A Postmodern marination of the Etheric bodies in mass [digital technology] 
media of horrific image, violent gaming, pornography..
 A Fairfield, Iowa Coffee haus Satsang commentary:
So what do they do? It is like an addiction, is that they don't know where to 
look so they keep looking back into the same stuff for the distraction of 
whatever it is in the moment, and then you just invited in more of the crap, 
all this astrality. It is horrific and then it is spinning into their minds and 
in how their minds work. They can't think clearly, they have all this mental 
chaos, they don't know how to source themselves, their inner self, nor do they 
really have any understanding of anything because they are literally 
over-loaded with these images, all these horrific energies, it is bad. Really, 
really bad.

---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 Ollie, you are right on both levels. I am journalizing here about what [great] 
spiritual people also are observing in their experience. Pope Francis and the 
Dalai Lama proly say the same thing, my sister-in-law who is deep with the SRF 
[Yogananda] spiritual movement reports similarly, that a pace in modern times 
evidently is exacerbating un-cultivated energies with consequences on a level. 
Evidently this is not the first time in history whence profound technological 
change hath wrought deeper or debasing mental agitations. Maybe not on your 
remote mesa out there but people who travel are seeing and recording a change 
in a collective human condition. 
 That NPR interview reflects on it too,  “Do we have issues now? Yes. Are they 
greater now? Yes, because of the split second that you get the news, it happens 
in Dallas at 6:01 and it’s all over the world at 6:05. So we’re hearing things 
more now. So is it better? Yes. Opportunities? Yes. Up to me now? Yes. Freedom 
to get your education? Yes. Freedom to go where you need to go? Yes. So, when 
we say that [it's better] and, I’ll use this term, the millennials say, "How 
can you say it’s better when we have all these issues today?" Well, Mr. 
Millennial, you hadn’t been there. You weren’t there. So let me enjoy my better.


---In, <olliesedwuz@...> wrote :

 Am I reading this right? This notion that being connected to the Internet 
somehow destroys our inner silence? That sounds like mood-making. There is 
nothing that can destroy the silence within, unless it is unstable and not yet 
established. Once established, it quietly radiates. That's it. There is a net 
forward momentum, unshaken, not stirred ether - lol. "The lamp that does not 
flicker in a windless place."
---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 The Spiritual Fairfield, Iowa Coffee haus Satsanga observes, post-modernism: 

 Debasing, debasing in a sense, it sounds like a judgement but it is not. All 
it is is in degrees of separation from your spiritual center.   All it is is 
degrees of connection to your spiritual center.         Quite literally 
debasing, as a base is what helps you navigate life. Everyone has a life that 
has its stuff in it.  Life is personal , we have our personal stuff, our 
collective stuff, lineage stuff, so we are busy, busy doing all this all the 
time working at it but the beauty, the Jai Guru Dev, of what we have is that we 
have something that restores us to our base. 
 These people are being actively and consistently debased.  It isn’t healthy. 
They become mentally ill.  They become emotionally ill. They suffer, their 
families suffer, it is so sad.  The community suffers, it is so sad. 


---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 We are no longer watering the root.  We are losing the (spiritual) arts to 
distractions of the internet and gradually the subtle disappears from the 
world.  Sit easy in meditation.  Do sadhana.  Go inside, going inside is very 
important when one gives up our body (to the 'commotion') then we can 
understand the shakti-maya. Meditate easily more. As the chakras clear the 
mental field clears. Meditate more -Karunamayi, Trenton, NJ July 2016 


---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 "Something internal has to take place.." 


 MMY apparently said, “All stress is in the heart”.  Getting to the heart there 
was an insightful bit of journalism on NPR Marketplace recently.  Ostensibly 
the piece was about racism in America. But within the piece there was an 
insightful bit about an inside of the problem.

 "..Rights to do what?  There’s right to do good.  There’s right to be treated 
right.  There is something out there that is trying to create separation in its 
most violent form. But we had some foundation not to retaliate in a violent 
way. [Martin Luther King, Gandhi] This generation does not have that and  sadly 
innocent lives are taken.  How do we stop it?  Changing Presidents and 
governors won’t change it.  The political arena won’t change it. I can’t fix 
you.  Something internal has to take place.. "
 quote from,
---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 In ongoing satsanga in Downtown Fairfield, Iowa the spiritual satsanga 
observes: that people overburdened and destabilized.. 
 "So then it spins out, the spiritual ego, the sense of “I am a being of light, 
I am connected to God”, a spirit, a inner life is not there. So then they are 
tormented there, they end up becoming tormented by the concepts of their field. 
They end up tormented by the content of their field."



---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 Dispirited. Interesting by comparison, the coming on of the industrial 
revolution propelled by technologies then that displaced 18th and 19th Century 
artisan and village life into concentrated urban slums, concentrations of 
wealth moving people off of land and out of homes this evidently triggered a 
similar mental agitation then in the collective of ‘yogic-body’ or the subtle 
system and light body then. An agitation like we see with this current digital 
e- technology revolution that has eliminated needs for whole categories of 
clerical and industrial manufacturing work and turned a lot of people out in to 
being renters. 

 Likewise this modern technology revolution even in farming has certainly 
de-populated the rural landscape here in Iowa concentrating land ownership in 
to the hands of absentee land-owning and driving a new class of landless 
operators by rent of the land from the owner class. Suicide rates in farmers 
now are some of the highest given all the turbulence of rapid technological 
change in agriculture. 


---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 I been reading about the Paris communard of the 1870’s and they talk about 
this mental agitation of their period as “the social question”.  There was lots 
of mental commotion going on then also with varying models of description about 
what was going on and the cause. Eventually Marx published his own commentary 
and economic theories by the end of the 19th century.  Lot of mental commotion 
though that is told as economic and political revolt that evidently was also in 
the psycho-spiritual of the spiritual fields of the mental bodies.  - “The 
Social Question” manifest. 


---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 This is true, Ollie but here it is observed again about the collective in 
trend..  I am out in NJ right now on a meditation retreat weekend where a 
post-modern mental agitation or chaotic disability is again pointed at as a 
collective phenomena in the subtle or spiritual system of nervous systems, what 
Karunamayi here from her travels is labeling, a mental ‘‘commotion’ as in what 
she is calling the sidha or yogic bodies.  She does agree with you in extent 
about the transformational effect that one person ‘subsided in commotions’ can 
have on others and the importance of that for now and in the collective.    

 She, Karunamayi, is an amazingly persistent stalwart sadhana advocate. 
Advocating, inciting folks to make use of all that is the human being 
birthright.   Old TM'ers who were with Maharishi on courses in the 1960’s and 
70’s would enjoy this satsang and fit right in.  In ways she is most like 
Maharishi right now.  About 500 people came here for a weekend silent 
meditation retreat. It is a lot of long silent meditating as a group with her.  
Is interesting also that these are serious meditation practitioners from all 
over the place and different meditator movements.  It is quite a powerful 


---In, <olliesedwuz@...> wrote :

 The issue though exacerbated by these digital baby sitters aka smart phones, 
is the imbalance within. Nothing wrong with communication devices. I sure don't 
want a return to tethered rotary phones, and have my weekly source of trivia be 
antenna TV, and "That's Incredible!", with Kathy Lee Crosby and Jon 
 The key with 'smart' tools is to ensure they don't use you, instead of the 
other way around. The hubub around being so device-oriented is already calming 
down among younger kids - just another thing to have in your pocket, like a 
pocket knife or yo-yo was to us.
Regarding collective mental agitation the only way to do something about it 
[for others] is to transcend the nature of the Self and abide in all things. 
This is the only way to foster peace on a large scale, each of us continue 
developing consciousness, into wholeness [Unity] and then totality [Brahman].
---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 Within Satsang Fairfield, Iowa..  There is satsang, spiritual conversation, 
going on all the time it seems everywhere you go in Fairfield. In shops, on the 
streets and sidewalks in passing, at the hardware store, out while pumping gas, 
in the grocery stores, on porches, in cafes.   Active Spirituality it seems is 
in so much of a conversation in Fairfield. Fairfield is a remarkable place this 
way. Satsang: A spiritual
 or sacred
 In listening, here is more along the lines of satsang-like conversation from 
Fairfield about what seems a general or collective mental agitation in our 
modern times.. On this topic from sitting with folks having coffee at one of 
the cafes one day and other comments from after a collective meditation in 

 "Computers and digital media, we all do it. It is a tool that we all use that 
we get sucked into often by
 necessity. It is a tool where people are not out engaged face-to-face with 
others, out with others, they are not out in nature in the simplest ways, so 
then you end up with un-grounded people who are, depending on what they are 
watching, if they are watching violence, horrific violence, and doing violent 
games, which some of these people I work with do, pornography too, oh my god it 
eats up, it eats up, it invites in the most base vile energies into your 

..When you do this it is an astrality, it affects the emotions. So, when the 
emotional subtle body becomes destabilized with this, when it is loaded with 
all these impressions and all these very mixed and some of them very degraded 
types of emotional states then it throws everything off so then the person 
can't find themselves, can't find their source, they can't find their soul 
because they have this overburdened wildly out of control astral body."

---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 These Fairfield people and Ammachi for example are looking at what seems an 
ambient mental field ‘agitation’ going on in the collective, and looking at 
evidently what is debasing that is trend in the rise of the post-modern 
digital/media age. Someone relating:

 I worked recently with a dad, he felt very frightened, angry; like a 
mass-media kind of hysterical person.  They are just so overwhelmed with no 
respite from it and they don’t even know how to find it.   
 Those are kind of fatiguing, there is not a lot of meeting. It is not like 
they are evil people, it is just they are afflicted.  And, probably they could 
hold some pretty angry thoughts.    

 You just do what you can do in a session.  So, I bring in light, I pray for 
help, whatever maximally can be absorbed, fine, let it be so.  Whatever can be 
done to help this person make it maximally beneficial to this person so they 
get some relief, get some base so that they have some experience with it other 
than their agitation.  As to its enduring value I get no idea at the time other 
than just the potential of shifting something that will help them find 



---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 Yes, your sensibility about ‘pedal to the metal' is practical advice along 
with MMY’s ‘dying the cloth’ for ‘meditate and act’ as analogy for spacey-cadet 
seekers along the way..  And, assuming there is a collective increase in 
spirituality going on, as you say, to integrate spiritual growth as a 
householder then 'pedal to the metal' in practical life.  
 Similarly in Ammachi’s reflection on this other trend phenomena [debased 
mental fields] she also included, find points to help others. .. to help ground 
the agitated human being in addition to spiritual practices.  


---In, <olliesedwuz@...> wrote :

 Yep, there are always trade-offs and challenges with any new technology. Not 
sure why this is a big deal. Sometimes it seems that the increased sensitivity 
growing from spiritual practices ends up making people weaker and more 
victimized, which is standing the whole thing on its head. The best way to 
integrate spiritual growth as a householder, is damn the torpedoes, full steam 
---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 Mental chaos, of the Post-Modern World..


 Someone in Fairfield commenting  

 It depends on the situation but some can have a phenomenal amount of mental 
agitation.  Sometimes when I put my hands out and feel into their emotional 
body, there is such distress, So much that it throws them off balance. The 
distress throws them off, there is no coherence, it is just reactive and no 
feeling of alignment in the system.  Sometimes you will feel something, about 
how they were before like when they were children when they were younger and 
had more native alignment as children, but the agitation is pretty rough.  
 Q: This 'alignment', becomes an indicator of the continuum of spirituality, of 
spiritual well-being? 
 A: Yes, if there is no alignment it means the intelligence of the chakras is 
not coordinated, they are not really informing each other.  So, you have all 
these blocks. Certain chakras, often times the lower ones are sitting on the 
shelf, the hearts are cut off, the throats are cut off, they will have all this 
mental agitation in the mental field above.

 ..Ammachi spoke that it is by grace of nature (spiritual practice and good 
life) that we can be integrated and help ourselves spiritually as human beings. 


 93rd Psalm:

---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 Grace! 'Tis a charming sound,
 Harmonious to the ear;
 Heav'n with the echo shall resound,
 And all the earth shall hear.

 Grace first inscribed the way
 To save rebellious man;
 And all the steps that grace display,
 Which drew the wondrous plan.

 Grace taught my wand'ring feet
 To tread the heav'nly road.
 And all the steps that grace display,
 Which drew the wondrous plan.

 Grace all the work shall crown
 Through everlasting days;
 It lays in heav'n the top-most stone,
 And well deserves our praise.  


---In, <dhamiltony2k5@...> wrote :

 No, Empty, Maharishi was very much working on this too in his last technique 
that he was developing in the last years of his life, the Ved and Physiology 
technique. This was a technique to cultivate the integration of the mental 
fields and subtle system fields in the body of the human physiology. With some 
awareness you could use all the Maharishi programs to do this.  Quite frankly 
if someone used all the venues of practices Maharishi offered the subtle system 
then one gets integrated into.. an integrated enlightenment of the spiritual 
system whole.  

 A month or so ago Dr. Antoine Nader, Maharaja Adhiraj Rajaraam, you may call 
him Tony Nader, was telling a group of us in the Dome that he would be teaching 
vibrational techniques related to this in the close future. 

 Very likely if the great sage and spiritual teacher Maharishi Mahesh Yogi were 
alive still today he would be commenting on the debasing spiritual influence in 
aggravated mental fields as a downside of the coming of the post-modern 
ubiquitous use of digital media devices throughout culture.   



Are you not substituting Ammachi's pronouncements for the clear statements of 

Why the duplicity? 


 Post-Modern Gadget/Product technologies.. 

 This past week in Chicago Ammachi in satsang there spoke to what she is seeing 
in people as she tours as a psycho-spiritual phenomena of disintegrating the 
human being spiritual subtle system by technology gadget.  She spoke to this in 
her homilies before and after the group meditations there.  That there is a 
world-wide problem in mental and environmental agitation now from electronic 
gadgets having becoming ubiquitous creating its own disabling dis-ease with a 
mental agitation within people world-wide.

 paraphrasing Ammachi's spiritual talks:

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