wrote:
>
> I occasionally eat meat myself, so I am not innocent by any means.
>
> But in light of what we know about:
>
> 1) bird flu -- that it comes from poultry livestock which are raised
> for eating;
>
> 2) AIDS: from this article -- that AIDS developed from wild chimps
> and that it was probably during the process of butchering a chip for
> food consumption;
>
> 3) Many other diseases that come from raising cattle livestock and
> transferred to humans -- I read where the reason that so many
> aboriginal peoples died from the European invasion (it was in the
> 10s of millions)
A 100 million or more, acording to the sytnthesis of acadameic
research Charles Mann pulled together in the book 1491. From the
published research from many disciplines, he paints the picture of
pre-columbian americas that were more populous, at an equivalent or
higher cultural, ploitical and agricultural state, had better cities,
large tradenet works spanning 1000s of miles etc.
The "no livestock" non-resistance evidence is apparently strong and
growing. Once columbus and others landed diseases such as chicken pox
raced to population centers far faster than the "explorers" did on
land. So large population centers were wiped out with no direct
European contact. There are many reports of early Europeans finding
inland ghost villages after establishing settlements on the coast some
years earlier. After 50-100 or so years, many signs of the large
native population centers had vanished -- and were absorbed and
further covered by european settlement.
And the book has fascinating details about Squanto of "pilgrim" days.
He lived in England PRIOR to his days with the pilgrims. The victim of
a French trader's kidnapping.
was that North and South American aboriginal
> peoples never kept domesticated chicken or cattle and, as such,
> never built up a resistance to the transferred diseases the way
> Europeans did and the way other peoples in other continents that th
> Europeans did.
>
> Well, maybe we can conclude that carnivorism does have some very
> direct karmic effects!
>
>
>
> ---------------
>
> HIV's Ancestry Traced to Wild Chimps
> May 25 2:02 PM US/Eastern
> Email this story
>
> By LAURAN NEERGAARD
> AP Medical Writer
>
>
> WASHINGTON
>
>
> Twenty-five years after the first AIDS cases emerged, scientists
> have confirmed that the HIV virus plaguing humans really did
> originate in wild chimpanzees, in a corner of Cameroon.
>
> Solving the mystery of HIV's ancestry was dirty work. Scientists
> employed trackers to plunge through dense jungle and collect the
> fresh feces of wild apes _ more than 1,300 samples in all.
>
> Before that, it took seven years of research just to develop the
> testing methods to genetically trace the primate version of the
> virus in living wild chimps without hurting the endangered species.
>
> Until now, "no one was able to look. No one had the tools," said Dr.
> Beatrice Hahn of the University of Alabama at Birmingham. She led
> the team of international researchers that reported the success in
> Friday's edition of the journal Science.
>
> "We're 25 years into this pandemic," Hahn said. "We don't have a
> cure. We don't have a vaccine. But we know where it came from. At
> least we can make a check mark on one of those."
>
> Scientists long have known that nonhuman primates carry their own
> version of the AIDS virus, called SIV or simian immunodeficiency
> virus. But with one exception, it had been found only in captive
> chimpanzees, particularly a subspecies that in the wild populates
> mostly West Africa.
>
> It was not known how prevalent the virus was in chimps in the wild,
> or how genetically or geographically diverse it was, complicating
> efforts to pin down the jump from animal to man.
>
> Hahn's team tested chimp feces for SIV antibodies, finding them in a
> subspecies called Pan troglodytes troglodytes in southern Cameroon.
>
> Chimps tend to form geographically distinct communities. By
> genetically analyzing the feces, researchers could trace individual
> infected chimps. The team found some chimp communities with
> infection rates as high as 35 percent, while others had no infection
> at all.
>
> Every single infected chimp had a common base genetic pattern that
> indicated a common ancestor, Hahn said.
>
> There are three types of HIV-1, the strain of the human virus
> responsible for most of the worldwide epidemic. Genetic analysis let
> Hahn identify chimp communities near Cameroon's Sanaga River whose
> viral strains are most closely related to the most common of those
> HIV-1 subtypes.
>
> "The genetic similarity was striking," Hahn said.
>
> The first human known to be infected with HIV was a man from
> Kinshasa in the nearby country of Congo who had his blood stored in
> 1959 as part of a medical study, decades before scientists knew the
> AIDS virus existed.
>
> Presumably, someone in rural Cameroon was bitten by a chimp or was
> cut while butchering one and became infected with the ape virus.
> That person passed it to someone else.
>
> The Sanaga River long has been a commercial waterway, for
> transporting hardwood, ivory and other items to more urban areas.
> Eventually, someone infected made it to Kinshasa.
>
> "How many different transmission events occurred between that
> initial hunter and this virus making it to Kinshasa, I don't know.
> It could have been one, it could have been 10, it could have been
> 100," Hahn said. "Eventually, it ended up in an urban area, and
> that's where it really got going."
>
> Somewhere in all that spread, the virus became more deadly to people
> than it is to chimps, who seldom are bothered much by SIV.
>
> The research seems to settle any question of HIV's origin, said Dr.
> Anthony Fauci, the National Institutes of Health's AIDS chief.
>
> When tracing a virus' evolution, "it's important to get as close to
> the source as you can," he said. "It's of historic interest."
>
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