--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> On Sep 18, 2006, at 5:25 PM, authfriend wrote:
> >> So I'm wondering where you get the idea from that
> >> it's normal, or even sort of normal, to wind up in
> >> an institution after dealing with a spouse's death?
> >
> > I never even *remotely* suggested it was "normal" or
> > even "sort of normal," and I haven't a clue where you
> > got the idea that I did.
> OK, good.

"OK, Judy, I sure seem to have misunderstood you
completely on a whole bunch of points."

  Then why do you keep mentioning her illness in relation to 
> her having lost Doug, as if one almost followed naturally from the 
> other?

I believe I've mentioned it exactly twice.

> It doesn't.  In fact, from what I've been able to gather, 
> Debbie's condition, *if*  brought forth solely or even mostly, by 
> Doug's death, would be somewhat rare.  You kept trying to connect 
> the two as if it were far more common. That seemed to be clearly
> your intention. I'm glad you've learned better. :)

Let's see if you are able to learn better.  I doubt it,
but maybe, *just maybe*, this will help:

My point in both cases had nothing whatsoever to do
with how common clinical depression is or is not
following the death of a spouse.  We don't even know
whether Debbie had clinical depression.  We *do* know
she became emotionally ill after Doug died.

In both cases, the folks I was responding to appeared
to be attributing Debbie's illness to her TM practice.
My point was that before assuming someone's emotional
illness was caused by their TM practice, we should ask
whether there was anything *else* going on in their
lives that might have been responsible.

In Debbie's case, she had just gone through an
extremely traumatic experience.  Some people *do*
fall apart after the death of a spouse; it isn't
uncommon (in other words, although it isn't common,
it isn't as rare as you suggest).  That's why there
are therapists who specialize in grief counseling,
to help such people get themselves together again.

If they're predisposed to depression, they may
become clinically depressed.  Or they could suffer
from severe anxiety, or any number of other
conditions.  This is regardless of whether the
marriage was "healthy."  Any major trauma--and
the death of a spouse usually constitutes such
a trauma--can trigger a breakdown, even in
apparently psychologically healthy people. There
may be a chemical component, for example, or the
person may have a weak spot in their psychological
makeup that had never before been assaulted.

Most likely, I should think, joining Mother Divine
didn't help, if only because it wouldn't have
given her the opportunity to grieve, which is
essential for recovering from bereavement.  She
may have joined MD, at least subconsciously, to
avoid *having* to grieve, since it wouldn't have
been encouraged.

Grieving isn't a fun process.  She may have found
her grief so overwhelming that she thought she had
to find some way not to have to confront it.  And
she likely wouldn't have gotten a lot of help when
she began to fall apart, either, however that
manifested itself.

I wouldn't be *surprised* if the extended TM
practice in MD also helped trigger the breakdown,
but I'll bet you a buck that joining MD was a
symptom of a preexisting problem that proceeded
to get worse because she was trying to escape it
rather than deal with it.  I also suspect giving
away most of her money was another symptom.

But bottom line, whatever went wrong with Debbie,
one would want to *rule out* that it was triggered
by Doug's death before automatically attributing it
to her TM practice.  That was the point I was 

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