--- In [email protected], TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I'll make an exception and reply to one of Swami J's > posts here, because she *knows* that what she's implying > below isn't true. > > BTW, you'll notice that disciple John is letting Swami J > fight his battles for him. Get used to it.
You're attacking Judy, asshole, not me. And what makes you think your perpetual self-apparent ego act warrants any automatic response from me? Oh yeah, it's part of your phony act. > > --- In [email protected], "authfriend" <jstein@> wrote: > > > > A few of the details in Barry's account didn't quite > > sound right to me, so I decided to check on the earlier > > versions Barry has related on FFL and alt.m.t. ... > > > > And here's an earlier version from FFL, a year ago: > > > > ======== > > > > > LOL, didn't Charlie say something to M like "Maharishi, an > > > hour and a half? I wouldn't wait an hour and a half for > > > Jesus Christ!" > > > > Yup, almost word for word. I was the "door guy" at > > the hotel room door that night. I told the folks > > inside that Charlie was there, and watched them > > tell Maharishi. Charlie waited for an hour or so, > > and then stormed off, shouting those words. Later, > > because I was the door guy, I was the one who > > Maharishi told Charlie was to blame for keeping > > him out: "They never told me." They told him. > > > > ======== > > > > In the current account, it was Charlie *making up* > > a "grand paranoid tale" about "Jerry's minions" > > keeping him out of the room. > > > > But last year, it was MMY himself who told Charlie > > that. > > As you well know, Swami J ( recognize the phrase > "As you well know"? :-), that part came *after* > the part of the story I just retold. It happened > at the airport the next day, when Charlie showed > up to see Maharishi, having blown him off the > night before. > > Charlie went up to Maharishi and said something > to the effect of, "I was there at the hotel last > night, but they told me to wait outside." > > Maharishi looked Charlie straight in the eye and > said, "No one ever told me you were there." > > THAT is a LIE. > > I *watched* the person tell him. I *watched* MMY > tell the guy to tell me to have Charlie wait. > And Jerry Jarvis and a couple of other close > friends (not to mention Merv and Clint) were > sitting right there close enough to *hear* him > say it. Jerry and the others confirmed this to > me after the Charlieshit later hit the fan. > > But now, face to face with Charlie Lutes, Maharishi > told him that "No one told me." > > Go figure, eh? That's a Zen puzzler for those of > you who think Maharishi never lies. > > But even more so, it's a head-scratcher for those > who think Swami J never lies. She just got back > from reading the earlier version of these stories, > so she knows what went down, and in what sequence. > But that's not quite how she told it, is it? > > > ======== > > > > I was once or twice the target of some of Charlie's pettiness. Do > > you remember the story I related here recently of being stuck on > > "door duty" the night Merv and Clint were there and Maharishi > > kept Charlie waiting in the hall for several hours? Well, after > > that > > particular incident, because I was the asshole at the door, Charlie > > decided that *I* was the one who had "kept him away from MMY." > > The fact that I often attended his Friday night meetings and had > > been on very friendly terms with him up to that point didn't seem > > to factor into his thinking -- I was at the door, I was to blame. > > So he launched a campaign to get me fired from my plush :-) > > $500-a-month job at the Regional Office, calling Maharishi in > > Switzerland several times to accomplish this. (Somehow I survived.) > > > > ======== > > > > Oops. In this version, Barry seems to have > > "forgotten" that it was MMY who told Charlie > > Barry was the one to have kept him out of > > the room. We're back to Charlie's "paranoia" > > again. > > Not true. Maharishi never assigned blame. If I said > so earlier that was fast writing on my part. He merely > lied and said to Charlie, "No one ever told me you > were there." Charlie *assumed* it was me who had lied > to him about telling Maharishi when I came back out > and told him that Maharishi had asked for him to > wait. > > > But here we do see Barry's motivation for > > sneaking a tape recorder into one of Charlie's > > lectures, in revenge for Charlie having tried > > to get him fired. > > The tape recorder incident was months before the > Merv taping. > > As you might say, Oooopsie. :-) > > > Or, did Charlie try to get Barry fired *because* > > Barry had surreptitiously taped his lecture to > > make him look bad, and because MMY had told him > > Barry and Jerry's other "minions" were responsible > > for his not being able to see MMY? > > Charlie never knew I taped any of his lectures. > He didn't know me except to say Hi to before the > incident at the airport. It was only after that > that we began to hear reports of him going to Maharishi > and trying to get me fired from the Regional Office. > > But let's spend a moment on "surrepititiously taped > his lecture to make him look bad." > > That's quite a view of the universe you have there, > Swami J. Now I understand why you were so upset about > the Things TMers Believe series of quotes I collected. > You're under the impression that taping or reposting > someone's exact words is an attempt to make them look > bad. I taped the *entire lectures*. The entire talks > were on the tapes, and never got edited from the > tapes, so you can't even pitch a hissy fit and claim > "OUT OF CONTEXT" in a loud, hysterical voice the > way you did with the Things TMers Believe series. > > They were *his* words, just as he said them. And you > are trying to make someone recording them *at the > request of the TM International Staff* a bad thing. > Any other time, you'd be giving me shit for *not* > doing exactly as I was told. :-) > > Then again, you are busy defending John Manning for > calling Edg a liar, something he has *no way* of > knowing is true. And then again, *you* tend to call > people liars yourself, often when you have no earthly > way of knowing that that's true. What a fuckin' loon. > > > Only Barry knows what the time sequence was here. > > But one way or another, it appears that Charlie > > had plenty of reason to dislike and distrust > > Barry. > > Which is interesting, because before his rather > juvenile attempts to extract "retribution" on me > for an imagined affront, I didn't dislike Charlie > at all. I found him amusing and didn't take him the > *least* bit seriously. I kinda considered him a > buffoon, same as I consider you. (Only I respected > Charlie more.) I did the taping thing because I was > asked to, and the *reason* I was asked to was that > I was the only one who worked at National who had > a small minicassette recorder. :-) > > It wasn't even National's *idea* to check up on > Charlie's lectures and see what he was saying. > They were told to do so by International Staff. > > > ======== > > > > I was in a position several times to see how Maharishi treated > > Charlie. He often kept him waiting in hallways for *hours*, > > knowing full well that he was there, knowing he was impatient > > and would sooner or later throw a tantrum and stalk off, and > > then, just when Charlie was about to storm off in a snit, > > Maharishi would call him into the room and then say, "Oh, they > > (meaning Jerry and/or whoever was on 'door duty' that night) > > never told me you were there." > > There were other instances where MMY kept Charlie > waiting, and then called for him *just* as he was > about to leave. The evening before the second > Merv taping wasn't one of them. Charlie managed > to stalk off *before* Maharishi invited him in > this time. > > > ======== > > > > And now we're back to the alternate story again, > > that MMY regularly blamed Jerry and "his minions" > > for keeping Charlie out of the room. > > I don't think it has *ever* been suggested that > "MMY regularly blamed Jerry and 'his minions' for > keeping Charlie out of the room." Swami J just made > that up. Maharishi often *claimed to Charlie* that > they hadn't told him that he was waiting, but they > always had, and Maharishi knew that. Everyone would > have been too *afraid* of Maharishi to *not* tell > him that Charlie was there. Maharishi was lying to > Charlie, and shifting the blame to "Jerry's kids." > > It was Charlie and *his* minions who claimed that it > was all a big plot on the part of Jerry and "his" > TM teachers. Not MMY. It is my belief that this story > was started by Charlie himself, after the incident at > the airport. > > > ======== > > > > As for the situation at hand, I'll let you decide. I was the poor > > schmuck stuck with "door duty" one night in L.A. when the people > > waiting in the hall were Merv Griffin, Clint Eastwood, Charlie, and > > about a dozen Just Meditators. I had dutifully announced everyone > > as they arrived to Maharishi, so he knew they were there. Merv and > > Clint got in first. Their TV show was the next day; it was an > > etiquette no-brainer. :-) Then a couple of the Just Meditators got > > let in. One of them was a young woman I had announced several times, > > because I'd talked with her a little about why she was there. Then, > > after a few hours, Maharishi called Charlie in. > > > > Anyway, I guess my point is, "How do you think I *should* have > > acted?" > > > > I, as a mid-level flunky so far down on the Power Chain that I was > > stuck outside the door while all the action was going down in the > > room, guess I could have done more to get the Important people in. > > Merv and Clint only waited a few minutes, but I guess I could have > > announced Charlie twice. Or maybe three times, since he was so > > Important. > > > > ========= > > > > This one's really interesting. It appears to > > be the same *occasion*, the night before the Merv > > taping. But in this version, Charlie waits for hours > > and finally *is* let in. > > No, Maharishi asked for Charlie to come in about one > minute after he had stormed off in a snit. He never > got in that night. You may look upon this as some kind > of psychic "seeing" on MMY's part if you'd like, and > I know you'd probably like. :-) > > > And Barry acknowledges this time that he *did* have > > a hand in keeping Charlie out, by choosing to announce > > him only once, when Charlie might have gotten in if > > MMY had been reminded that he was still waiting. > > I announced *everyone* once, to the persons inside > the room who were in charge of determining who was > to be admitted to a closed business meeting. That's > how it was done. No one was ever forgotten. Their > names went on a written list, as I'm sure did > Charlie Lutes' that night. > > I made an exception and announced the young woman > more than once because she was dying. > > I suppose you're going to find a way to demonize > *that* in me, too. > > I suppose *you* would have announced Charlie multiple > times, right? Yeah, right...the only reason you're > defending Charlie now is because I gave John a hard > time, and you've got to "defend your disciple." You > don't think much of Charlie Lutes, either, and have > said so rather overtly in the past. > > You're just taking advantage of the situation to > blast me. Which is a really pissy-assed and childish > thing to do, in my opinion. You seem to have attained > the same emotional and behavioral age as Charlie Lutes. > > Having made one exception, I've changed my mind about > not reading your posts and/or replying to them for two > months. > > Make it four months. If you're lucky. > > The first "penalty" was just for being a chronic > overposting asshole. This one's just for being you. >
