My Tucson wasn't diagnosed until she was 4 -5 years old.  She'd been around
my other 3 all their lives and nobody ever tested positive.  They eat
together, groom each other, use the same litter boxes, and have had those
occasional scuffles that drew blood.  To be honest, I'm more careful about
exposing her and Romeo, my other FELV+, to the neg cats when they're sick.
I think the pos ones are the ones at greater risk.  I did vaccinate my negs
when I found out Tucson was pos, don't do it every year though.  And my vet
is another one who always likes to double check their neg status whenever
one gets sick with something a little different.  No one has ever shown up


Christiane Biagi


Cell:  914-720-6888



[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sharyl
Sent: Monday, July 21, 2008 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Introducing Daisy's Babies


Thanks Tonya.  That is reassuring to hear.  Sissy and Rocket so want out of
the bedroom.  


--- On Mon, 7/21/08, catatonya <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: catatonya <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Introducing Daisy's Babies
Date: Monday, July 21, 2008, 1:06 AM



I have vaccinated my negatives.  Yearly at first, and now every 3 years.  I
do not separate.  Mine have been mixed going on about 15 years now and I've
never had transmission.  All my sick cats always get retested by my doubting
vet, and they are always negative!


Sharyl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

MC, I read the Merck info when Sissy and Rocket, now 9 mo. old, 1st tested
positive.    What concerns me is the last statement

"Uninfected cats in a household with infected cats should be vaccinated;
however, other means of protecting uninfected cats (eg, physical separation)
should also be used. Constant exposure to FeLV-infected cats is likely to
result in viral transmission regardless of vaccination status."


My Pequita, going on 16, was dx with CRF 2 1/2 yrs ago.  Since then the only
vaccine she has gotten is rabies.   I'm taking Stormie, a 10 mo. old
negative rescue, in for her FeLV booster shot Monday.   I'll talk to the vet
then about a booster for Pequita.  


Rocket is thriving and is asymptomatic.  Sissy has had enlarged lymph nodes
since her rescue in Feb.    The swelling has gone down since she was spayed
and I had her baby molars removed.  My concern for Pequita and Stormie
needing her follow up booster are the main reasons they are quarantined in
the bedroom.  Tiki, my healthy 4 yr old, is current on her FeLV boosters. 


The babes are quarantined in a dog crate in my garage at night and an
outside cat enclosure during the day.  I was concerned about them stressing
Sissy and Rocket.  I had the babies in their bathroom the 1st night and it
seemed to upset them.  Right now I have 9 cats on 5 different diets.
Starting to wear me out but you do what you have to.


It appears mine got FeLV by nursing from an infected Mother since Stormie
from the same colony tested negative.   


To be honest I can not afford to test the cats I will be TNRing.  I can make
sure they don't have any more kittens thereby preventing infected kittens.
And I can make sure they eat well.  I will not PTS a cat who appears to be
healthy.  It took 3 visits to the vet with Sissy and Rocket before they
believed me that these girls were not going to be PTS and they might as well
start folders for them. 

Thanks again for the info. 



--- On Sun, 7/20/08, MaryChristine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: MaryChristine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Introducing Daisy's Babies
Date: Sunday, July 20, 2008, 5:53 PM

unfortunately, not enough vets know as much as they really ought to. many,
many times i wish that i knew MORE, because i am NOT a vet, i am NOT a
virologist, and just do my best to make the things i've found clearer to
others--and hope that those who know more than i do, will do likewise!

i think that EVERYONE who has a FeLV, and who knows one, or who ever has
loved one, needs to play out copies of--of have the url to tattooed where
they can show it everyone--the most recent merck manual, where they've got
the most up-to-date figures about how many cats do NOT remain viremic after
exposure..... shelters, rescues, vets, people who claim to follow alley cat
allies' policy yet in practice test all cats and then KILL felvs (yet brag
about the FeLVs they have at home): there are no excuses for ignorance, and
now that the anecdotal info that the brave people who came before us is
reaching the mainstream, ignorance about FeLV is a CHOICE when made by
professionals, veterinary or rescue. 

here's that link again, and while i DO get tired of posting it, oh, well, if
i don't (and you don't, and you don't, and you, there, over in the corner
snuggling with your cute little FeLV baby, don't), no one else will.....)
The Merck Veterinary Manual -Feline Leukemia Virus and
ine%2cleukemia>  Related Diseases: Introduction 

do you have other cats? (yeah, i know, i could go back and reread
everything, but.....) are you isolating the little ones because of their
FeLV status, or presumed status? are the older ones vaccinated against FeLV?
if so, you really don't have to worry about them mixing with the young ones
if the adults are healthy.... as the old-timers on this list can tell you,
so far no one has been able to find a single, documented case of a TRUE
negative (tested at least twice, with enough time for exposure and
seroconversion times taken into consideration) becoming positive from LIVING
with (closely, not just breathing on in passing) a TRUE positive (as above;
testing positive over time, using at least two kinds of tests). current
vaccination efficacy rates at 95% (yes, i am trying to find WHERE that
figure is hiding in my hard drive; i know it was susan little, dvm, of the
winn feline foundation, that gave that figure to a cat-health list in the
past two or three years. many places state--not always with any proof or
citation--that cats seem to develop a natural immunity to the FeLV virus
around the age of one year, and with the KNOWN high percentage quoted in the
merck re: ability to remain or become negative after exposure, anyone can
see how miniscule the risk is for a vaccinated cat.

is there a risk? of course there is. is it a higher risk than the same
negative cat is going to have some genetic defect in its own history you
have no knowledge of? i'm starting to think the latter is a much higher

you might want to talk with some of the folks who have positives running
around their houses with the rest, now and in the past, and see why they
made that decision....

i wish that i could tell you that these little ones will, indeed, throw off
the virus on their own and be as adoptable as any others. kittens with FeLV
still appear to have less of a chance at a long life than those infected
later in life, but we don't know enough to say why, and which ones have the
best chance, nor what we can do to ensure that they get that absolute best

thank you for loving them. that's the best gift of all, anyway.


On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 6:49 PM, Sharyl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Thanks MC for explaining the ELISHA test.  I had Mattie tested when her Mom.
Daisy, was spayed.  A lady here on the Eastern Shore drives up to MD once a
month to a vet who does low cost spaying for rescues.   She doesn't know
anything about FeLV and just relayed the vets comments.  


Sissy and Rocket have had two ELISHA tests 4 months apart.  When I 1st
rescued them and again when they were spayed.  Since they were FeLV+ I went
with the local high cost vet for the spaying.   Didn't want them stressed
any more than necessary.  I plan to have the IFA test done late this yr.
Both are currently the picture of health and tired of being quarantined in
the bedroom.  


I have read the info on the Ally Cats web site.  I agree that healthy cats
should not be PTS.  The Yahoo Rescue group I belong to feels that TNR
kitties should not be tested as long as they are healthy when
spayed/neutered.   Like the military 'don't ask, don't tell' philosophy.
The exception is any cat that will be placed for adoption.


There were 5 kittens in Sissy and Rocket's litter,  One vanished.  One,
Daisy, has been TNR and I have one, Mae, to go.  No idea who their Mom was.
I haven't see any likely candidates around the dumpster site.  With 3
negative inside cats I just can't take them all in.   I think I have lined
up a forever home for 2 of the babies, Bright Eyes and Houdini, in a home
with FeLV+ cats.  Since Mattie is blind and Capt.CJ only has sight in one
eye, I'll keep them.  So far I have just had Mattie tested.  No reason not
to believe all 4 babies are positive.  I will have them tested when they are
spayed.   Maybe, since they are no longer nursing and eating well, they can
kick it.

Thanks for your input.


--- On Sat, 7/19/08, MaryChristine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: MaryChristine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 

Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Introducing Daisy's Babies

Date: Saturday, July 19, 2008, 2:59 PM 


just wondering if you are working with alley cat allies, and following their
protocol re: testing and releasing/treating FeLV cats? my understanding is
that they do not endorse euthanizing positive, asymptomatic cats, so testing
daisy would only give you some health information. i believe they have a
really good explanation for how they've come to their decisions re:
testing--i am also very aware that their decision regarding this is
controversial. all the of the experienced feral rescuers i know personally,
however, whether they have specific experience with FeLV or not, have said
the same thing: we do NOT kill healthy cats just because they MIGHT get sick
at some point.

what a concept!

and also not sure what you mean when you say the cats have tested
positive--using which tests? how far apart? 

On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 10:21 AM, Sharyl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

I have been feeding a dumpster colony of kitties for several months with the
goal of doing TNR (trap/neuter/release) for those that I can not rescue.  Of
the 3 kittens I rescued 2, Sissy and Rocket, were FeLV+.  They are about 9
months old now and are doing well.  Both have test positive twice.

Their sister, Daisy, had a litter before I was able to TNR her.  The kittens
were approx. 4 weeks old when I got them.  I took them because 1 had both
eyes stuck shut and 1 had 1 eye stuck shut.  The next day I was finally able
to trap Daisy using a kitten as bait in the carrier.    Daisy has since been
spayed and released.  The babies have received one worm treatment, got
terramycin salve in their eyes for a week, and have lysine added to their


It appears that Mattie will be blind.  She is the biggest of the 4 and very
feisty.   I had her tested and the vet said she was very, very, very FeLV+.
No idea what 3 verys mean.  CJ may have some limited vision in her bad eye.
Bright Eyes and Houdini (escaped from the dog crate twice now) seem healthy.
I am adding L-Lysine and Mega C Plus to their food.  I am looking for advice
on what else I can do to help them throw off this virus.  


They will each be tested when I have them spayed.   Sissy and Rocket were
several months old when I rescued them.  Didn't know if starting treatments
earlier would improve the odds that they could beat this.   Any advise on
how to proceed with now 5 1/2 wk old kittens would be appreciated.


By the way Stormie, same colony but different Mom from Sissy, Rocket and
Daisy, tested negative.  I did not have Daisy tested.  I knew I could not
afford to keep her if she was positive and simply do not have the
disposition to have a cat PTS simply because she is positive.   At least she
will not have any more litters.  There is one more sister, Mae, that I have
been trying to trap for TNR.

Sharyl Sissy, Rocket and the babies

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