Dear Lou, thank you for your response.
On Wed, Mar 9, 2016 at 9:53 AM, Louis H Kauffman <lou...@gmail.com> wrote: > Dear Plamen, > I suspect that what you would like to know about ‘distinction logic’ is > how distinctions arise in natural systems. > I would like to know more about this also! > I suspect Spencer-Brown has beeen working on this too. > One can imagine that complex interactions can under appropriate > circumstances lead to dynamic closed loops of interaction and even > concomitant spatial distinctions (in the eye of an observer of the system). > Such patterns would be the subject of a distinction logic or a logic of > distinctions for that observer. There is the related question of how > observers can arise but this is looped around with the first question. The > two questions are linked with one another and one can imagine that systems > that produce partly stable looping processes can begin to create naming and > reference. > This sounds intriguing. Does not this go into biosemiotics? > If they can do that, they will not be far from self-reference. Exactly how > this could be done is a mystery. But that it happens is evident in the > biological world. > So we come back to the old Searle thesis about self-reference? https://halshs.archives-ouvertes.fr/ijn_00089222/document > > On the other hand you may be interested in the simplicities of the > calculus of indications or variations of that. I would be happy to talk > about that. When I do it is at the level of human observer and our mutual > abilities to distinguish, agree and disagree. > I see. This is the level of the scientist. This should be doable. Self-referential microbes are out of question for the moment. Thanks! Plamen > Best, > Lou > > On Mar 9, 2016, at 1:10 AM, Dr. Plamen L. Simeonov < > plamen.l.simeo...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Dear Lou, Pedro and Colleagues, > > > I think that Pedro made an interesting comment suggesting an extension of > Lou’s original model that another sort of recursion can be injected from > the outside world in terms of multiple nested loops of action. That the > species (r)evolution was accelerated and “harmonized” via “cross-cultural” > exchange of DNA segments invoked by viruses is a known fact now. It also > changes to some extent the meaning of infection diseases from something > “bad” to fight into a sort of necessary symbiosis for the co-evolution of > the system Earth/Cosmos. So, it makes sense to think and ask whether by > creating more and more artificial drugs and vaccines against infections we > do not intervene in the mutation of viruses in a way that cannot be > regarded as response-able, because of also being too reductionistic with > respect to what are the consequences for both ourselves and the BIG unknown > ecosystem outside our bodies. I am curious to know what do you think about > the option to try integrating Turing Oracle Machines in such extended > recursive models of living systems, which integrate viruses in the > evolutionary loop. This idea was suggested in the course of our integral > biomathics discussions in the past. In other words, what do you think about > linking a formal biomathematical representation and a biocomputation > responsive mechanism in maintaining an autonomous biologic? Perhaps we need > multiple layers of abstraction, i.e. multiple biologics, and not only the > bimolecular and cellular ones. And also, do you think there are other > mechanisms for information transfer, e.g. in prokaryotic cells and archaea, > also addressing the principles of circularity and recursion? > > > Another question I have is ignited from Pedro’s reflections upon your > circularity model for reproduction and directed to both of you. If > biological “clocks” such as the circadian rhythm are the result of an > evolutionary impressed repetition of action, are they the carrier or the > carried, or perhaps both, and if so how does this come into being? I recall > a paper by Koichiro Matsuno in the former 2013 IB special issue “Making > Biological Theory More Down to Earth” which said something interesting > about the role of cycles in maintaining identity and life, also from the > phenomenological perspective concerning the distinction between self and > outer world. Here is where I’d like to learn more about the distinction > logic like Pedro. > > > Thank you. > > > All the best. > > > Plamen > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > Fis mailing list > Fis@listas.unizar.es > http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis > > >
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