[EMAIL PROTECTED] Mon Apr 05 05:00:31 2004 Return-Path: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> X-Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Apparently-To: [email protected] Received: (qmail 21619 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2004 11:58:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Apr 2004 11:58:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO p01mgw01.macromedia.com) (216.104.212.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Apr 2004 11:58:40 -0000 Received: from S1001EXM02.macromedia.com ([10.4.48.132]) by p01mgw01.macromedia.com (Switch-3.1.4/Switch-3.1.0) with ESMTP id i35Bsrnh019523 for <[email protected]>; Mon, 5 Apr 2004 04:54:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by S1001EXM02.macromedia.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id <G3CST3V3>; Mon, 5 Apr 2004 07:54:53 -0400 Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 07:54:50 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C41B04.CC9C3B21" X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 216.104.212.90 From: Robert Crooks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [flexcoders] Future Speed Improvements for Flash Player? X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=76095156 X-Yahoo-Profile: rcrooks666
------_=_NextPart_001_01C41B04.CC9C3B21 Content-Type: text/plain Hi Brian, I am not aware of this limitation. Do you have a sample app I could pass over to the Player team to test this and work on it? Robert _____ From: Brian LeRoux [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 2:00 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [flexcoders] Future Speed Improvements for Flash Player? Robert, my concern is with the Flash Player's performance when there are more than 50 movieclip's working within a swf. As I'm sure you guys know, after that magic number performance degrades significantly and onRelease events begin to get dropped by the player. Its a frustrating wall to hit. Original Message: >From: Robert Crooks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "'pk_wasp '" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "'[email protected] '" <[email protected]> >Subject: RE: [flexcoders] Future Speed Improvements for Flash Player? >Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2004 21:45:31 -0500 ><html><body> > > ><tt> > No boos here -- Macromedia has a healthy crop of J2EE developers :)<BR> ><BR> >The performance question is a complicated one and I'm hoping others will<BR> >pitch in, but I want to at least break out some separate issues. On the<BR> >whole I don't think it is at all true that Flash apps (meaning SWFs, however<BR> >created) are slower or less responsive than HTML based or Swing apps. But<BR> >let's break the question down into some separate parts:<BR> ><BR> >1. initial download time to client: here a well-made HTML *page* should<BR> >perform better than a Flash/Flex app; I don't have stats, but I feel pretty<BR> >confident that a SWF will generally be smaller and download more quickly<BR> >than an equivalent Swing-based. But comparing HTML to SWF or Swing here is<BR> >very misleading, because with HTML you can only download a page of an<BR> >application at a time, whereas in SWF or Swing you can download a whole app<BR> >-- and that's why the HTML appears to perform better.<BR> ><BR> >2. response to user actions on the client: here a SWF will almost always win<BR> >easily over an HTML-based app, because it contains the whole application,<BR> >and doesn't need to pull additional views from the client for every event,<BR> >or call server-side application methods for all but trivial presentation<BR> >logic. This is the crucial thing to remember: the SWF is a complete app on<BR> >the client, and you only need make new requests to the server if you need to<BR> >pull/push additional live data; otherwise events can be handled on the<BR> >client. Although I again don't have stats, what I know about the way Java<BR> >and ActionScript are handled tells me that a Swing app should have a slight<BR> >edge here, though in using many SWF and Swing apps, I've never noticed one<BR> >being noticeably more responsive than the other.<BR> ><BR> >That being said, The Flash Player team is always looking for ways to improve<BR> >performance, and might be interested in trying to reproduce your performance<BR> >issues with apps like to Flex Store on low Mhz systems to see if we can<BR> >learn something by isolating the bottlenecks. If you're interested in<BR> >pursuing this, can you send more detailed specs of your typical system --<BR> >RAM, how you installed Flex, what app server it's running on, etc?<BR> ><BR> >Robert<BR> ><BR> >-----Original Message-----<BR> >From: pk_wasp<BR> >To: [email protected]<BR> >Sent: 4/3/2004 5:12 PM<BR> >Subject: [flexcoders] Future Speed Improvements for Flash Player?<BR> ><BR> >Hi<BR> ><BR> >I'm a J2EE Developer (please don't boo me :) ) looking into RIA (for <BR> >Intranet Apps anyway). I'm still waiting for the Trial Flex CD to <BR> >arrive (can't wait) but 1 think i've notice is that the Flash <BR> >Movies/Sites/Apps are noticably slower and less responsive then Java <BR> >HTML Form Apps/Windows Apps etc even slower then Java Swing Apps.<BR> ><BR> >Are there any plans/rumours with for the next Flash Player to have a <BR> >performance increase like last time?. I know desktop machines are <BR> >getting faster but the majority of our clients are still stuck on <BR> >machines with less then 500Mhz CPUs.<BR> ><BR> >Coz FLex supports liquid layout, lots of new controls etc the only <BR> >thing stopping me from recommending management to take a serious <BR> >look @ Flash is the speed e.g Flex Store demo didn't run too well on <BR> >600MHz machines.<BR> ><BR> >It'll be good to read up on articles on how to optimise Flex/Flash <BR> >for lower end client machines, does any1 know of any?<BR> ><BR> >cheers.<BR> ><BR> ><BR> ><BR> ><BR> ><BR> ><BR> ><BR> > _____ <BR> ><BR> >Yahoo! Groups Links<BR> ><BR> ><BR> >* To visit your group on the web, go to:<BR> ><a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/> ">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/> </a><BR> ><<a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/> ">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/> </a>> <BR> > <BR> ><BR> >* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:<BR> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]<BR> ><mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <BR> > <BR> ><BR> >* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of<BR> >Service <<a href="http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> ">http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> </a>> . <BR> ><BR> ><BR> ></tt> > > > > ><!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| --> > ><br> ><tt><hr width="500"> ><b>Yahoo! Groups Links</b><br> ><ul> ><li>To visit your group on the web, go to:<br><a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/> ">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/> </a><br> ><li>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:<br><a href="mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">fle [EMAIL PROTECTED]</a><br> ><li>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the <a href="http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> ">Yahoo! Terms of Service</a>. ></ul> ></tt> ></br> > ><!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| --> > > ></body></html> > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT <http://rd.yahoo.com/SIG=12cr3mg30/M=281792.4727319.5879690.1261774/D=egroup web/S=1705007207:HM/EXP=1081188104/A=2058224/R=0/SIG=116652qbq/*http://my.ya hoo.com/promo/ppets.html> click here <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?M=281792.4727319.5879690.1261774/D=egroupweb /S=:HM/A=2058224/rand=620366502> _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . ------_=_NextPart_001_01C41B04.CC9C3B21 Content-Type: text/html <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=GENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=519135311-05042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Hi Brian,</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=519135311-05042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=519135311-05042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I am not aware of this limitation. Do you have a sample app I could pass over to the Player team to test this and work on it?</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=519135311-05042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=519135311-05042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Robert</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR> <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left> <HR tabIndex=-1> <FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> Brian LeRoux [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <BR><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, April 04, 2004 2:00 PM<BR><B>To:</B> [email protected]<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: [flexcoders] Future Speed Improvements for Flash Player?<BR></FONT><BR></DIV> <DIV></DIV><TT>Robert, my concern is with the Flash Player's performance when there are more than 50 movieclip's working within a swf. As I'm sure you guys know, after that magic number performance degrades significantly and onRelease events begin to get dropped by the player. Its a frustrating wall to hit.<BR><BR>Original Message:<BR>>From: Robert Crooks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]><BR>>To: "'pk_wasp '" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "'[email protected] '" <[email protected]><BR>>Subject: RE: [flexcoders] Future Speed Improvements for Flash Player?<BR>>Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2004 21:45:31 -0500<BR><BR>><html><body><BR>><BR>><BR>><tt><BR>> No boos here -- Macromedia has a healthy crop of J2EE developers :)<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>The performance question is a complicated one and I'm hoping others will<BR><BR>>pitch in, but I want to at least break out some separate issues.&nbsp; On the<BR><BR>>whole I don't think it is at all true that Flash apps (meaning SWFs, however<BR><BR>>created) are slower or less responsive than HTML based or Swing apps. But<BR><BR>>let's break the question down into some separate parts:<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>1. initial download time to client: here a well-made HTML *page* should<BR><BR>>perform better than a Flash/Flex app; I don't have stats, but I feel pretty<BR><BR>>confident that a SWF will generally be smaller and download more quickly<BR><BR>>than an equivalent Swing-based.&nbsp; But comparing HTML to SWF or Swing here is<BR><BR>>very misleading, because with HTML you can only download a page of an<BR><BR>>application at a time, whereas in SWF or Swing you can download a whole app<BR><BR>>-- and that's why the HTML appears to perform better.<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>2. response to user actions on the client: here a SWF will almost always win<BR><BR>>easily over an HTML-based app, because it contains the whole application,<BR><BR>>and doesn't need to pull additional views from the client for every event,<BR><BR>>or call server-side application methods for all but trivial presentation<BR><BR>>logic.&nbsp; This is the crucial thing to remember: the SWF is a complete app on<BR><BR>>the client, and you only need make new requests to the server if you need to<BR><BR>>pull/push additional live data; otherwise events can be handled on the<BR><BR>>client.&nbsp; Although I again don't have stats, what I know about the way Java<BR><BR>>and ActionScript are handled tells me that a Swing app should have a slight<BR><BR>>edge here, though in using many SWF and Swing apps, I've never noticed one<BR><BR>>being noticeably more responsive than the other.<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>That being said, The Flash Player team is always looking for ways to improve<BR><BR>>performance, and might be interested in trying to reproduce your performance<BR><BR>>issues with apps like to Flex Store on low Mhz systems to see if we can<BR><BR>>learn something by isolating the bottlenecks. If you're interested in<BR><BR>>pursuing this, can you send more detailed specs of your typical system --<BR><BR>>RAM, how you installed Flex, what app server it's running on, etc?<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>Robert<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>-----Original Message-----<BR><BR>>From: pk_wasp<BR><BR>>To: [email protected]<BR><BR>>Sent: 4/3/2004 5:12 PM<BR><BR>>Subject: [flexcoders] Future Speed Improvements for Flash Player?<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>Hi<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>I'm a J2EE Developer (please don't boo me :) ) looking into RIA (for <BR><BR>>Intranet Apps anyway). I'm still waiting for the Trial Flex CD to <BR><BR>>arrive (can't wait) but 1 think i've notice is that the Flash <BR><BR>>Movies/Sites/Apps are noticably slower and less responsive then Java <BR><BR>>HTML Form Apps/Windows Apps etc even slower then Java Swing Apps.<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>Are there any plans/rumours with for the next Flash Player to have a <BR><BR>>performance increase like last time?. I know desktop machines are <BR><BR>>getting faster but the majority of our clients are still stuck on <BR><BR>>machines with less then 500Mhz CPUs.<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>Coz FLex supports liquid layout, lots of new controls etc the only <BR><BR>>thing stopping me from recommending management to take a serious <BR><BR>>look @ Flash is the speed e.g Flex Store demo didn't run too well on <BR><BR>>600MHz machines.<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>It'll be good to read up on articles on how to optimise Flex/Flash <BR><BR>>for lower end client machines, does any1 know of any?<BR><BR>><BR><BR>>cheers.<BR><BR>><BR><BR>><BR><BR>><BR><BR>><BR><BR>><BR><BR>><BR><BR>><BR><BR>>&nbsp; _____&nbsp; <BR><BR>><BR><BR>>Yahoo! Groups Links<BR><BR>><BR><BR>><BR><BR>>*&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; To visit your group on the web, go to:<BR><BR>><a href="<A href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/";>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/</A>"><A href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/";>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/</A></a><BR><BR>>&lt;<a href="<A href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/";>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/</A>"><A href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/";>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/</A></a>&gt; <BR><BR>>&nbsp; <BR><BR>><BR><BR>>*&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:<BR><BR>>[EMAIL PROTECTED]<BR><BR>>&lt;mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]&gt; <BR><BR>>&nbsp; <BR><BR>><BR><BR>>*&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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