I have worked with for about a year (a year ago). I think it was ok, though I haven't done very advanced things...
> -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thomas Rühl > Sent: woensdag 9 augustus 2006 15:31 > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Re: [Flex2] What do you use for > modelling a Flex2 application...? > > > Hey folks, to keep up the thinking ;) > > After some days of testing, testing and well... testing the > UML tools out there, I think I finally found something that > might work well for me. My tool of choice is Enterprise > Architect by SparxSoftware: > http://www.sparxsystems.com > > Some of the others, that I had my hands on are: > * ArgoUML > * MagicDraw > * Visio > * some others > > They all - well, except Visio which s*cks - have a touch of > Java in them > - as if it is the only programming language available. In my > opinion, the Enterprise Architect will be the best solution > for me, since it is the most unspecific in terms of the > programming languages. It has Actionscript support > implementet though, but I didn't see the need to turn that on > explicitly. > > Again, thanks for all your interest in the discussion. > > Cheers, Thomas > > ------------------------------------ > > Thomas Rühl > Design, Programming & Concepts > > akitogo OHG > Hanauer Landstrasse 188 > 60314 Frankfurt > > Telefon +49 (0) 69 800 69 445 > Fax +49 (0) 69 800 69 449 > Mobil +49 (0) 179 750 75 87 > E-Mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Web http://www.akitogo.com > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Bjorn Schultheiss wrote: > > > > D, > > > > OK cool, > > > > I retract the comment earlier about the contradicting statement. > > > > From your description i see the combination of both the HOW and the > > WHAT as the definition of a front end developer. > > My understanding is that the HOW process is where the > designer aspect > > of the developer comes into play and the WHAT process is > where the OOP > > Code Freak aspect of the developer comes into play. > > To me the HOW is a visual question while the WHAT is the code > > implementation of the HOW solution. > > > > Perhaps this definition is not what originally intended but does it > > make sense? > > > > Regards, > > > > Bjorn Schultheiss > > Senior Flash Developer > > QDC Technologies > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -- > > *From:* [email protected] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > *On Behalf Of *Dave Wolf > > *Sent:* Tuesday, 8 August 2006 10:46 AM > > *To:* [email protected] > > *Subject:* [flexcoders] Re: [Flex2] What do you use for modelling a > > Flex2 application...? > > > > > > I think you are misunderstanding that I am saying. Let me > try it this > > way and see if my point comes across more clearly. > > > > A large portion of UML is dedicated to answering the > question of WHAT > > you are developing. For example, use cases and activity > diagrams both > > focus on figuring out WHAT the problem set involves. So as > an example, > > WHAT you are designing might be an account registration > process which > > needs to support the ability to validate a users password by a > > pluggable number of password rules. That is the WHAT. > > It doesnt go into HOW you plan to implement that screen or process. > > > > The HOW side would be modelled in something like a class > diagram or a > > state transtion diagram. It might model that you need to create an > > interface (code not graphical interface) which defines an API for a > > pluggable set of rules (say the Command pattern that > Cainforn loves so > > much) etc. UML can wonder from the WHAT and into the HOW in certain > > digrams. Some UML tools can generate source code to > implement the HOW > > side of the equation. > > > > Yes I would argue that there is a lack of Flex specific UML > tooling, > > but Flex is very new. I would not be surprised to see more UML code > > generation tools. Then again there are actually quite a few > UML tools > > that can generate AS itself. A quick Google search reveals many. > > > > > http://www.google.com/search?q=actionscript+UML&start=0&ie=utf-8&oe=ut > > f-8&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official > > > <http://www.google.com/search?q=actionscript+UML&start=0&ie=utf-8&oe=u > > tf-8&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official> > > > > I'm quite a fan of a product called Enterprise Architect which has > > ActionScript 2 support in it. Check it out at > > > > http://www.sparxsystems.com/ea.htm > > <http://www.sparxsystems.com/ea.htm> > > > > Hopefully I made my point about the difference between WHAT > and HOW in > > UML. The confusion came in that you were not interested in code > > generation. > > > > I will leave my editorial comments about code generation > and Caingorn > > for another thread. For folks that have followed my threads > here for > > the last few years I think my position is well known. > > > > -- > > Dave Wolf > > Cynergy Systems, Inc. > > Adobe Flex Alliance Partner > > http://www.cynergysystems.com <http://www.cynergysystems.com> > > http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs > > <http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs> > > > > Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > <mailto:dave.wolf%40cynergysystems.com> > > Office: 866-CYNERGY > > > > --- In [email protected] > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>, "Bjorn Schultheiss" > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > The cowboy disagrees. > > > > > > I have just heard you pour your heart out about your innovative > > approaches > > > to developement process and how cool your UI's are. > > > Then in the next paragraph let me quote. > > > I dont think that your choice of HOW you develop software has any > > impact on > > > WHAT you are developing, > > > > > > I for one would be all for the developement of a UML tool or FB > > plugin that > > > will generate code that leverages the Cairngorm framework. > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Bjorn Schultheiss > > > Senior Flash Developer > > > QDC Technologies > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: [email protected] > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > [mailto:[email protected] > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>] On > > > Behalf Of Dave Wolf > > > Sent: Tuesday, 8 August 2006 7:01 AM > > > To: [email protected] > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > Subject: [flexcoders] Re: [Flex2] What do you use for modelling a > > > Flex2 application...? > > > > > > > > > > > > Flex development *is* like traditional development. The > richness of > > > the user experience and the wonder that you can deliver > in terms of > > > creativity does not open the door to chaos in the > development process. > > > > > > Just because historically people feel Flash development > was "cowboy" > > > doesnt mean that Flex development has to assume that role. Our > > > clients range from little startups to the second largest > retail bank > > > in the nation. Cowboy is not an option. > > > > > > We may have an innovative approach to the development > process, one > > > which borders on some more bleeding edge ideals (say > Agile), however > > > the dicipline in the development process is the same. > From our model > > > and design sessions, to cases in the issue management system, to > > > strict use of source control, automated builds and deploys, unit > > > tests etc. That's how great software is written > regardless of the technology. > > > > > > We are passionate about the richness of the user experience. You > > > will see it in the amazing UI's our folks are building > and in our people. > > > We are also passionate about the development process. > > > > > > This thread started by talking about modelling tools and how > > > applicable they are to flex. I dont think that your choice of HOW > > > you develop software has any impact on WHAT you are > developing, and > > > modelling is all about WHAT. > > > > > > -- > > > Dave Wolf > > > Cynergy Systems, Inc. > > > Adobe Flex Alliance Partner > > > http://www.cynergys <http://www.cynergysystems.com > > <http://www.cynergysystems.com>> ystems.com > > > http://www.cynergys <http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs > > <http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs>> > > ystems.com/blogs > > > > > > Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:dave.wolf%40cynergysystems.com> > > stems.com > > > Office: 866-CYNERGY > > > > > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > ups.com, > > > "Joost Nuijten" <flexcoders@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Sometimes I wish Flex development was more like traditional > > application > > > > development. At the other hand I shiver at the thought that the > > > coolness of > > > > Flex is degraded to this way of working. Flex = Flash. > And Flash > > > > is > > > supposed > > > > to be a creative chaos, cool, far away of the boreness of the IT > > > world and > > > > full of passion. That is how it's supposed to be. > > > > > > > > But it really depends on your kind of business... > > > > > > > > ~joost > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > > ups.com > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > ups.com] > > > Namens > > > > Thomas Rühl -akitogo- > > > > Verzonden: maandag 7 augustus 2006 9:59 > > > > Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > > ups.com > > > > Onderwerp: Re: [flexcoders] Re: [Flex2] What do you use for > > modelling a > > > > Flex2 application...? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for your interest so far... but this isn't really the > > > direction I > > > > intended to point out. > > > > > > > > Dave, I know that the documentation and modelling process > > > > basically doesn't depend on HOW an application is > written. I'm not > > > > trying from model to generated code, although it would > be really > > > > neat to do so in some cases ;) > > > > > > > > My concern is to evolve a process, starting with modelling an > > > > application the "good old" way using software architecture > > > > possibilities. This not only helps me to evaluate and > improve an > > > > application, in fact it is also important for me regarding > > > documentation > > > > and maintenance processes. > > > > > > > > Again, I do not necessarily want to generate the code based on a > > UML or > > > > other kind of diagrams, my interest targets the development > > > > process before actual implementation starts. > > > > > > > > As I said, for the Java world, there are lots of tools which we > > > > are missing for Flex at the moment. Problem being, > these tools are > > > > mostly Java specific (for which I think they shouldn't), since > > > > they DO > > want to > > > > generate code out of the model. And this is the reason I am > > interested > > > > in how other folks do the modeling. > > > > > > > > Cheers, Thomas > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > Thomas Rühl > > > > Design, Programming & Concepts > > > > > > > > akitogo OHG > > > > Hanauer Landstrasse 188 > > > > 60314 Frankfurt > > > > > > > > Telefon +49 (0) 69 800 69 445 > > > > Fax +49 (0) 69 800 69 449 > > > > Mobil +49 (0) 179 750 75 87 > > > > E-Mail thomas.ruehl@ <mailto:thomas.ruehl%40akitogo.com> > > > > akitogo.com Web http://www.akitogo. <http://www.akitogo. > > <http://www.akitogo.com <http://www.akitogo.com>> com> > > > com > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > Jason wrote: > > > > > > > > > > There are several AS2 model2code generators such as: > > > > > http://www.darronsc > > > > <http://www.darronsc > > > <http://www.darronschall.com/weblog/archives/000174.cfm > > <http://www.darronschall.com/weblog/archives/000174.cfm>> > > > hall.com/weblog/archives/000174.cfm> > > > > hall.com/weblog/archives/000174.cfm > > > > > <http://www.darronsc > > > > <http://www.darronsc > > > <http://www.darronschall.com/weblog/archives/000174.cfm > > <http://www.darronschall.com/weblog/archives/000174.cfm>> > > > hall.com/weblog/archives/000174.cfm> > > > > hall.com/weblog/archives/000174.cfm> > > > > > http://www.codeallo <http://www.codeallo > > > <http://www.codealloy.com/umlconverter.htm > > <http://www.codealloy.com/umlconverter.htm>> y.com/umlconverter.htm> > > > > y.com/umlconverter.htm > > > > > <http://www.codeallo <http://www.codeallo > > > <http://www.codealloy.com/umlconverter.htm > > <http://www.codealloy.com/umlconverter.htm>> y.com/umlconverter.htm> > > > > y.com/umlconverter.htm> > > > > > and some others I can't remember right now. > > > > > > > > > > It will just be a matter of time untill someone > updates one of > > > > > the projects for AS3, and ideally for Cairngorm. > > > > > I poked around on sourceforge, but did not see an > started project. > > > > > > > > > > Darron Schall my be willing to provide his source as > a starting > > point > > > > > for anyone looking to pick up the project -- it looks like he > > > > > has a SVN repository set for the source. > > > > > > > > > > --jason > > > > > > > > > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > ups.com > > > > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>, "Joost Nuijten" > > > > > <flexcoders@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I think what Thomas is trying to say: > > > > > > > > > > > > In the Java world there are a lot of powerful tools that > > > > > > generate > > > > > the base > > > > > > skeleton of code out of a model. For the Flex world this is > > all hand > > > > > work. > > > > > > And how do we cope with this? > > > > > > > > > > > > That is why it is important that we have a framework such as > > > > > Cairngorm. The > > > > > > one thing that we do not have is an automated tool that > > > generates the > > > > > > Cairngorm base skeleton. > > > > > > > > > > > > ** thinking about creating one myself ** > > > > > > > > > > > > Joost > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > ups.com > > > > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > ups.com > > > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>] > > > > > Namens > > > > > > Dave Wolf > > > > > > Verzonden: maandag 7 augustus 2006 2:33 > > > > > > Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > ups.com > > > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > > > > Onderwerp: [flexcoders] Re: [Flex2] What do you use for > > modelling a > > > > > Flex2 > > > > > > application...? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why does the implementation language (the HOW) have > anything > > > > > > significant to do with the modelling and documentation > > solution you > > > > > > use (the WHAT) ? > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you trying to go from model to generated code? > > > > > > > > > > > > If modelling is important to your development > process, tried > > > > > > and trusted modelling solutions such as UML would > be capable > > > > > > of documenting and managing the WHAT side of the > development > > > > > > process regardless of the implementation HOW language. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Dave Wolf > > > > > > Cynergy Systems, Inc. > > > > > > Adobe Flex Alliance Partner > > > > > > http://www.cynergys <http://www.cynergys > > > <http://www.cynergys <http://www.cynergysystems.com > > <http://www.cynergysystems.com>> ystems.com> > > > > ystems.com > > > > > <http://www.cynergys <http://www.cynergys > > > <http://www.cynergysystems.com <http://www.cynergysystems.com>> > > ystems.com> ystems.com>> > > > > ystems.com > > > > > > http://www.cynergys <http://www.cynergys > > > > <http://www.cynergys <http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs > > <http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs>> > > > ystems.com/blogs> ystems.com/blogs > > > > > <http://www.cynergys <http://www.cynergys > > > <http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs > > <http://www.cynergysystems.com/blogs>> ystems.com/blogs> > > > > ystems.com/blogs>> > > > > > ystems.com/blogs > > > > > > > > > > > > Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > <mailto:dave.wolf%40cynergysystems.com> > > > > > stems.com > > > > > > Office: 866-CYNERGY > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > <mailto:flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > > > > ups.com, > > > > > > Thomas R�hl -akitogo- > > > > > > <thomas.ruehl@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi folks, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's been a while now, since the Flex2 SDK is out and > > > > > > > rockin' ;) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not only for larger projects, multiple teams or > team members > > > > > > > and documentation purpose, I'd like to know, what > everyone > > > > > > > is > > > using for > > > > > > > modelling a Flex application. For the Java world > I know, the > > tools > > > > > > > available are very powerful and work very well out of the > > box and > > > > > > > integrate with each other. There are also things like > > > > > > > OmondoUML, > > > > > which > > > > > > > we can be used for designing Java apps (doing use case and > > > sequential > > > > > > > diagram sort of stuff) in conjunction with creating the > > > > > > corresponding code. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The lack of Flex-specific tools for that kind of > work still > > leads > > > > > > > towards endless times spent on the drawing table > - at least > > on my > > > > > side.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, the question coming up my mind is, in what > ways do you > > > > > > > all > > > design > > > > > > > your Flex applications before/during or after > > > > > > > implementation, if > > > > > any....? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers, Thomas > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thomas R�hl > > > > > > > Design, Programming & Concepts > > > > > > > > > > > > > > akitogo OHG > > > > > > > Hanauer Landstrasse 188 > > > > > > > 60314 Frankfurt > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Telefon +49 (0) 69 800 69 445 Fax +49 (0) 69 800 69 449 > > > > > > > Mobil +49 (0) 179 750 75 87 E-Mail thomas.ruehl@ Web > > > > > > > http://www.akitogo. <http://www.akitogo. > > > <http://www.akitogo. <http://www.akitogo.com > > <http://www.akitogo.com>> com> > > > > com > > > > > <http://www.akitogo. <http://www.akitogo. > > <http://www.akitogo.com <http://www.akitogo.com>> com> > > > com>> com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Flexcoders Mailing List > FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt > Search Archives: > http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- Flexcoders Mailing List FAQ: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/files/flexcodersFAQ.txt Search Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
