Hi Simon, I'm one of the leaders for the Red5 project (http://osflash.org/red5), and I also run a consulting business focused on Flash, Flex, Java and Red5.
I saw this post that you sent to the Flexcoders list about the troubles that you are having with FDS and Hibernate. I thought that it might be worth your while to look at Red5. Integration with Hibernate through the Spring context is really well established and of course Red5 is open source so you could conceivably fix any problems that might arise. I know that others have successfully integrated Red5 and Hibernate with little or no problems. It would be great to get more people to look at using Red5 as an alternative to FDS. Right now, I don't think that people realize that you can even do this, not to mention the power in doing so. Anyway, feel free to contact me if you have any questions, and good luck with your project. -Chris On 2/23/07, simonjpalmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
PW and Jeff, PW, you and I seem to be in the same boat. I am trying to fight off the people who were flex skeptics to start with. Not being able to write data back makes the whole thing look pretty amateur and confirms people's belief that the technology isn't ready - which given this experience it clearly isn't. The baby is definitely at risk of being thrown out with the bath water. It stands in our company simply because I have the final call as Technical Director (CTO if you are in the US). I am a huge flex advocate and really doing my best to evangelise on the topic. What's more I think that the bridge to operational data is the most profound leap forward for flash, it takes it out of the world of gimicks and into the world of real business applications. Jeff, you and your and team deserve huge credit for that vision and excellent execution. However, much as it pains me to say it, the bottom line is that the hibernate middle tier provided does not work, as PW and I (and a host of other people on various forums) have found. I know that I can re-write the whole thing myself and will probably have to, but when introducing new technologies it is unfortunately all about initial perception. I have made a career of doing this sort of thing myself and I have seen excellent projects fail to fly because of low initial quality, even though we fixed them immediately, the damage was done because people's impression was that they were flaky. I'm sure you know it is hard to get back from that first impression and the word of mouth that springs from it. Once it becomes entrenched that opinion becomes fact and you are irrevocably lost. If I were Adobe I would be a little worried about the tone of the posts I am seeing about integration with Hibernate. The Hibernate Assembler is very important and I would really hate to see that happen to it. The corollary is very unfortunate. That little bit of technology transform the boardroom conversation about FDS. Suddenly the cost of the licensing of FDS becomes justifiable against the dev cost savings because we can just plug into the ORM. Having made that justification myself it is very difficult for me now to go back and say, "by the way I also have to incur the dev costs". When asked why? I have to confess that the Adobe code doesn't work and we don't know when we're getting a fix. For the Flex/Flash skeptics in the room that's a god send. For me it is a complete nightmare. It is hard for me to separate the cost of FDS licenses (which is almost prohibitively large) against the cost of dev. I would urge Jeff and Co to get the Hibernate Assembler code watertight and shipping asap. If I can be of any assistance I will gladly offer my services. If either of you would like to contact me, post a reply and I will happily give you my details. Simon Palmer Technical Director The PMCo 62 St Peters Street St Albans HERTS AL1 3HG UK --- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>, "parkerwhirlow" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Thats very unfortunate. I'm getting farther and farther into hot water > not being able to reliably update our data model using Flex. > > Last it was "just wait for 2.0.1, there's a lot of Hibernate/FDS fixes > in it" and now we're waiting for another unknown amount of time for > fixes we can only hope will help our situation. > > I'm apologize, I understand it's not your fault, and I really > appreciate the insight you provide as to what can be causing our > problems, I'm just getting up to my neck in unsolved problems. > > If you have any insight as to "roughly" when this next release could > occur, can you tip me off? > > thanks, > PW > > --- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>, "Jeff Vroom" <jvroom@> wrote: > > > > I have finished making the changes and the use of the "merge" call seems > > to be a) much simpler and b) more robust than the way the current code > > works. > > > > > > > > Unfortunately we've made enough changes to the code surrounding the > > HibernateAssembler so I can't just send you the updated file and have it > > work in FDS2. It will be in an upcoming public beta but I don't think > > we've announced the dates on that. > > > > > > > > Jeff > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com>] On > > Behalf Of parkerwhirlow > > Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2007 3:29 PM > > To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> > > Subject: [flexcoders] Re: FDS/Hibernate Sample of updating hierarchical > > list of values > > > > > > > > Hey Jeff, just curious if you've got any updated HibernateAssembler > > code with some fixes? Any idea when this would be available? > > > > thanks, > > PW > > > > --- In flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:flexcoders% <flexcoders%25>40yahoogroups.com> > > , "Jeff Vroom" <jvroom@> wrote: > > > > > > My apologies - this does look like a bug. I need to do more testing on > > > this case myself, but I think one of the big problems here is that we > > > are trying to do conflict detection on our own in the hibernate > > > assembler's updateItem method. Unless you are using a strict isolation > > > level in your DB (repeatable read or serializable) this is not going > > to > > > be transactionally correct anyway since the DB version can be modified > > > after we have executed the query and before we do our update. We > > > probably should not be getting the server version at all... hibernate > > > has its own optimistic concurrency support that we should be using if > > it > > > is enabled. That is probably the only way to get atomic conflict > > > detection without resorting to using those particularly slow isolation > > > levels. > > > > > > > > > > > > That would potentially get rid of the conflicting version of the item > > in > > > the transaction. The other thing I need to look into is the "merge" > > > method in hibernate. Seems like we should probably be using that in > > the > > > updateItem method? I'll be working on this next week so will send out > > > any updates I can to the code. > > > > > > > > > > > > Jeff > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > > > From: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:flexcoders% <flexcoders%25>40yahoogroups.com> > > [mailto:flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:flexcoders% <flexcoders%25>40yahoogroups.com> > > ] On > > > Behalf Of parkerwhirlow > > > Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 6:05 PM > > > To: flexcoders@yahoogroups.com <flexcoders%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:flexcoders% <flexcoders%25>40yahoogroups.com> > > > Subject: [flexcoders] FDS/Hibernate Sample of updating hierarchical > > list > > > of values > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi all, > > > > > > I have been tearing my hair out trying to get FDS/Hibernate to update > > > a hierarchical list of values. Even the simplest of collection > > > mappings in Hibernate cause various exceptions when trying to update. > > > > > > Before I post my details, does anyone have any examples of this that > > > work? Has anyone ever even gotten this to work? > > > > > > I have two objects mapped in Hibernate: > > > > > > - Family > > > ----Person > > > > > > where a Family has a Set of Person "familyMembers". > > > > > > My FDS destination is to Family, and I am trying to update a family > > > member (just the name) through this destination. > > > > > > First, I was getting Hibernate NonUniqueObjectException, which I > > > finally tracked down to having my hibernate collection mapping set to > > > lazy=false This caused all of the family member Person objects to be > > > loaded into the PersistenceContext when the HibernateAssembler loaded > > > the "serverVersion" of the Family. > > > > > > Then, once I set lazy=true on the collection mapping, I was getting an > > > exception that "A collection with cascade="all-delete-orphan" was no > > > longer referenced by the owning entity instance"... since it is > > > assigning a whole new collection to the familyMembers property one > > > becomes unreferenced, and the other referenced. Sooo I can't use > > > delete orphan to delete the family members when the family is > > > deleted... OK. So then I make cascade="all". > > > > > > Now I'm getting "ORA-01407: cannot update > > > ("SCHEMA"."T_PERSON"."FAMILYID") to NULL"... I'm guessing that it's > > > processing the dereferenced collection first (trying to detatch any > > > Person's from the family before they're re-attached by the new > > > collection. I can't believe this is so difficult... > > > > > > For more info on my setup and test case, please see my original post: > > > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/message/63308 > > <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/message/63308> > > > <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/message/63308 > > <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/message/63308> > > > > > > > any comments as to if anyone has done this successfully are greatly > > > appreciated! > > > > > > thanks, > > > PW > > > > > >
