Hi Chris,
I don't disagree with anything you're saying. I don't (and never have) run
3-d cockpits, I believe my hardware setup is too primative to support them.
This is not the fault of FG, it is a probelm I am saving up to remedy. You
are right;
"I can't run 3-d cockpits."
I run 098a binary and G099 data/0910 scenery but have tried a number of
aircraft that have been developed for the 099 binary that won't work or have
unpredictable behaviour when using the 098a binary.
From: Chris Metzler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
On Sun, 26 Feb 2006 18:47:26 +1300
dene maxwell wrote:
>
> Hi Chris,
>
> agreed, 3-D is not a 099 peculiarity... but I can't run 3-D cockpits
> under my implementation of 098a, I've put this down to hardware
> restrictions and it hasn't been important as there are plenty of
> options in the way of equally enjoyable aircraft.
> Some of the new aircraft are designed to run under FGFS 099 and have to
> have special makes to run under 098a. Again I reiterate this not
> because they have 3-d cockpits but for other reasons related to the
> changes from 098a to 099 (JBSim 2.0 and the changes to the FDM for
> example)
Sorry, I'm feeling really slow (probably because it's late where I am, and
I should go to sleep). There was a change in JSBSim configuration file
format in going to JSBSim 2.0; that has caused a lot of aircraft that
haven't yet been updated to not run under FG 0.9.9, and still others that
*have* been updated to not run under earlier versions (although one can
always hang on to an old version, I guess). But as you note above, that's
separate from the ability to run 3D cockpits. You're saying you can't run
3d cockpits under 0.9.8a? Were you able to under other versions? How does
the version come in, as opposed to "I can't run 3d cockpits, period"? Put
another way, you suggested that adding the 3D cockpit wouldn't be popular
with 0.9.8a users:
It is, perhaps, unfortunate that I chose this message to respond to with my
opinion,
3-D cockpits are not related to my (or any other users) inability to fly
certain aircraft under 098a to the best of my knowledge.
>>>> A separate A-10-3Dcockpit would make the existing A-10 redundant
>>>> - who would want to fly it without your cockpit? :)
>>>
>>> Maybe those langishing on 098a? From what I've seen of Alexis
>>> cockpit, I would love to fly it with his cockpit, as I enjoy the
>>> A10 FDM. But any new a/c, unless they have a 098a implementation,
>>> are useless to us.
This is assuming that the FDM will be updated as well. This may be an
incorrect assumption. As far as I'm aware, upgrading to a 3-d cockpit alone
will not stop 098a users, who can currently run 3-d cockpits, from flying
this fantastic a/c and a 3-d cockpit as shown in the screen shots can only
enhance this experience.
. . .and I'm wondering why the FG version matters when it comes to
adding the 3D cockpit. Plenty of people used 3D cockpits with 0.9.8a.
The reason I'm looking at this is because you described FG as "not
maintaining backward compatibility"; for the most part, I don't think
that's fair to FG. I agree that the JSBSim config file change is an
example of failing to maintain backward compatibility; but I'd claim
that it's not breaking backward compatibility in the way you describe.
Using the rest of the software industry as a guide, the breaking of
backward compatibility there is *not* in 0.9.8a not being able to digest
new aircraft; rather, it's in 0.9.9 not being able to use old aircraft
files as is.....
and this is the basis of my concerns for any aircraft upgrade....if an
aircraft is available under to fly an earlier version of FG then a version
that continues it to be able to be flown under that earlier vesion should
continue to be available. Ie as a separate aircraft (or build of)
.... That's the norm: new versions of software able to read
files for old versions of software; but not vice-versa, since that
would make adding functionality very difficult. For example, you can't
use MS Word 2003 .doc files in Word 97; but older .doc files will work
in newer versions of Word OK. And I don't think it's fair to call the
adding of more functionality, which in turn overtaxes older hardware,
as breaking backward compatibility. After all, that'll always be a
problem with sophisticated software -- try running Windows XP on
a 486DX machine.
My backward compatibility comments where mainly aimed at MP. Unfortunately
word processor analogies doesn't really apply as there aren't too mainly
truely MP applications in the commercial world (ie each user interacting
with others) Possibly the closest analogy is that of a DB app. If you run a
newer version of the front end than me on the same DB then I could
reasonably expect to encounter problems. At best using the old version of a
front end would cause data inconsistencies.
BUT
If I chose to stay with the old version front end then I could still expect
the functionality I had enjoyed to still be available. This is not the case
with 098a MP. 098a MP no longer exists and having supported a household
upgrade to cable 'net on the basis of being able to enjoy the MP experience,
you might be able to understand my disappointment when I found out what had
been, no longer was.
Of course, even if the above is true, it doesn't change that you've
got a problem. If the new 3D cockpit for the A-10 were to get added to
the A-10 in CVS, how would that mess with your A-10 experience? (I'm
not saying it wouldn't; I'm asking how you'd end up with those files
instead of the older version) You're running a set version, namely
0.9.8a; so I'm presuming you're using the 0.9.8a base package (data).
Is that right? Or are you using 0.9.8a with CVS data somehow, so that
a change to the A-10 would get you when you update the data from CVS?
Is it possible for you to just preserve an older copy of the A-10
somewhere, copying it back in or pointing FG to it as needed?
-c
I think the 3-D cockpit that Alexis has developed looks great. I have
publically acknowledged I am a big fan of Lee's A10.
I, in no way meant to rain on either of these fine gentleman's parades. If
this how I came across, I apologise to them.
I wouldn't like to see the older 2-d version of the a-10 "overwritten", I do
support a separate version of the a/c. How this is organised in CVS, I'll
leave to people more familiar with CVS than me.
--
=Dene
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