On Wed, May 10, 2006 at 10:25:32AM -0400, fbsd wrote:
> Thank you for making my point.
> This should have been announced on all lists.
> Just not the announcement list.

Wrong.  That is exactly what the announcment list is for.

> Changing the logo is really a big thing.

Not really.

> See the outcome of the short sightedness of that decision.

Yeah, we get lots of whining people like yourself wasting bandwidth.

> And why should just the core committers be
> the only ones given a vote.

Since they are the ones doing most of the job, it seems like
a reasonable place to draw the line.

> Most of them are too busy to even have been
> aware this was happening.


> Many professional logo design people never even knew about
> the contest to redesign the logo because it was not posted
> to the questions list where everyone reads.

Not everyone reads the questions list.  Heck, not even all the
developers do, due to the low signal/noise ratio here.

> What makes you think that the announcement list gets even
> a fraction of the readers the questions list does.

The fact that it is a much more important list to read.
If you only read one freebsd.org mailing list it should be
announce@ since that is where all important announcments are made
(including security advisories.)

> Hell the questinos list gets enought junk post all ready,

Yes, but that does not mean you have to provide even more evidence
of that.

> what's the harm in posting such an inportment message to the
> list to begin with, not doing so makes no sense at all.
> Somebody messed up big time and now they have to deal with the
> results of their stupid mistakes.
> You core committer people have to break out of this
> private club mentality thing you all adhere to.
> The logo effects all users and as such we should have vote in the
> matter.


> What were you all thinking? This was a bad idea from the get go.
> Just because core committer have the ability to write high level
> code
> does not give them the right to thumb your collective noses
> at the rest of us users in the matter of needing a new logo.
> In moving to an new legal status by forming the FreeBSD
> foundation us users just look the other way just long as
> the software stays free of cost and no new legal restraints
> are imposed on the software use.
> But changing the logo effects all users and sham on you
> self righteous snobs to even think you have the right to
> exclude the user community from the logo decision.
> Get off your high horses and serve your users like your suppose to.

You seem to be under the misapprehension that the developers
have any obligations to you.  That is not the case.

> I think the new logo should be shit canned and the whole
> question of replaceing the "beastie" logo brought up for
> a general vote bye all members of all the Freebsd mailing lists.

And I think you should stop whining about the logo and do something
useful instead.

> Your negtave comments are foundless.

Much like your allegations then?

> A public vote is not an logistical near-impossibility.
> Hell just creating a special list to submit an email
> to as your yes or not vote is a simple solution and other
> solutions could be found one way or the other.
> If you are insulted by my comments then I guess you
> belong the self righteous snobs group and I dont care about you.
> This is address the the users who like me are out raged by this.
> If you dont like the new logo then lets make our combined voices
>  make a differance by emailing the new foundation's forming members.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Nick Withers [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 8:37 AM
> Subject: Re: New freebsd logo on freebsd.org
> On Wed, 10 May 2006 08:13:24 -0400
> "fbsd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > As a long time reader of this list I did not see any
> > announcement of it here.
> That's because this is the freebsd-questions list. It was
> announced on the freebsd-announce list. Y'know, the one where
> announcements are made...
> > Only after selection of the new logo was made was it
> > talked about on this list People were very up set with it
> > them and the ground swell over this has only gotten bigger.
> Again, this is the freebsd-questions list. I don't really think
> that this is actually the most appropriate place for discussion
> of such things (and therefore I should probably apologise for
> contributing to this lil' thread!).
> > Loyal long time users are feeling insulted about being
> > left out from the decision about the need for a new logo.
> > A post in the archive give some lame reasons for a new logo
> > which many people disagreed with even then but still the
> > new legal FreeBSD foundation went ahead any how put it
> > on the official website.
> >
> > I for one do not see an need to change the logo at all.
> Perhaps not, but then again, this is why there's a core team to
> make decisions for the project. Granted they're not elected by
> every user who's ever heard the word "FreeBSD", but I can't
> even begin to imagine the logistical near-impossibility this
> would be.
> Committers were given the chance to vote, and voted for the new
> design (again, see http://logo-contest.freebsd.org/result/,
> which also has a link to the archived original announcement
> to freebsd-announce).
> > I would say special effort was made to keep this whole
> > new logo thing a secret from the general user population.
> See above, it was announced very publically on the
> freebsd-announce list.
> (snip)
> > -----Original Message-----
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 6:48 AM
> > To: Kep Woof
> > Subject: Re: New freebsd logo on freebsd.org
> >
> >
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 10/05/2006 11:42:17:
> >
> > > hi,
> > >
> > > On 5/9/06, Bill Moran <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Then take this to [EMAIL PROTECTED]  It's just flame bait
> here.
> > >
> > > I don't want a chat, I want to know where I can find out how we
> > ended
> > > up with such a terrible logo.  It seems people think it's a big
> > joke?
> > > The new logo already looks dated, and will only get worse with
> > time.
> > >
> >
> > This happened ages ago and was announced in the news section of
> the
> > website
> >
> > See - http://logo-contest.freebsd.org/result/
> >
> > John
> > _______________________________________________
> > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to
> --
> Nick Withers
> Web: http://www.nickwithers.com
> Mobile: +61 414 397 446
> _______________________________________________
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<Insert your favourite quote here.>
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