On Apr 30, 2007, at 6:19 AM, cpghost wrote:

On Mon, Apr 30, 2007 at 01:16:23AM -0700, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
The system that would cause problems if it ran
greylisting is not MY system. It's the mailserver owned by the cellular company that I am sending to. If they went and installed greylisting
it is highly unlikely I could get them to whitelist me.  (have you
ever, for example, tried to get a system off AOL's internal blacklist?)

Yes, that's indeed a problem; but how likely would that be?
Cellular operators know that their clients expect speedy
delivery of SMS, including those sent via SMTP. They know
better than to introduce greylisting latency at the gateway
when there's already normal latency at the SMSC.

Have you confirmed with your cellular operator that they
don't offer additional gateways; e.g. based on ICQ, HTTP
and whatnot? Most likely, they don't offer SMPP-over-TCP
connections to end-users ( http://www.smsforum.net/ ),
but probably to a couple of third-party providers that
you could use instead?

This won't work because you're suggesting he change the system he likes. No matter what, greylisting to him is apparently impossible because users need their email as an instant messaging service. The possibility of establishing a domain into a whitelist or testing a connection and notification system periodically, which would put his domain into their imaginary whitelist, is simply too inconvenient, unlike the deletion of spam that a greylist could have prevented coming into my inbox. That apparently isn't inconvenient or annoying in the least.

I apparently hold the wrong view. I think greylisting is still a pain in the butt for spammers. It causes mail servers to have to take the time to retry email, something spammers don't like wasting time doing. If they're doing something to spoof connections then the mail would not even retry because it's going to an illegitimate or nonexistent mail server. But none of this is possibly even a percentage of help for your mail server. Apparently the extra layers to try slowing or easing the load on your server is a waste because it's *possible* to bypass it without resorting to math magic like the stats poisoning used against SpamAssassin now.

For me, I want to slow their servers and waste their resources, just like they waste my CPU and storage space. I don't use email as an IM service nor do I use it as a critical availability service without investing lots and lots of money on redundancy, so I don't see the problem with companies using greylisting.
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