Hugh, I would propose that what we call "aesthetics" is derived from what served our fitness over evolutionary time.
So the crows may very well be dancing, for all "practical" purposes... db ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hugh Trenchard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group" <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 6:04 PM Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Will Rogers and Animal Behavior >I for one am rarely afraid to ask questions, stupid or otherwise, when my > curiosity is piqued. > > Do the ravens in Sante Fe align in vee formations when they roll off > chandelles? If they do, then regardless of whether they are having fun, > it > is an interesting pattern formation which causes one to ask reasonably why > they choose such a formation. Do they do it for the sheer pleasure of the > esthetics of the vee formation? This would, it seems, entail some "fun" of > the formation, although I doubt I would find many people who would argue > that is the fun they derive. So then why is it fun that they should align > in > those formations? > > I myself wouldn't claim to subscribe to a behaviourist school, unless you > can generalize the term to include analysis of the emergence of physical > patterns among collectives. Pattern formation within sandpiles is more > akin > to my specific interests than the behaviour of individual animals. That is > always interesting too, but it isn't the focus of my inquiry here. > > Hugh Trenchard > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Peter Lissaman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 1:05 PM > Subject: [FRIAM] Will Rogers and Animal Behavior > > >> When he was given a brief description of the learned theories of Dr. >> Freud, >> and told that they accounted for all human behavior, Will Rogers stated >> that: "he found it real interesting, but reckoned that in Oklahoma, folks >> mainly did things jes' acause they felt like it". I gave a paper at AIAA >> annual meeting in Reno earlier this week on birds extracting energy from >> turbulence. There's a lot in it for the birdies, with their low flight >> speeds, superb sensing and rapid response. Ravens in Santa Fe are >> marvellous aerobats in the turbulence rolling off the Sangres. But why? >> When you see them rolling off perfect chandelles, as with dolphins >> surfing >> and gamboling in the bow wave, you have to admit that they're "jes' >> havin' >> fun", contrary to these gloomy animal "behavioristos" who claim animals >> do >> everything for a reason. >> >> Peter Lissaman, Da Vinci Ventures >> >> Expertise is not knowing everything, but knowing what to look for. >> >> 1454 Miracerros Loop South, Santa Fe, New Mexico 87505 >> TEL: (505) 983-7728 FAX: (505) 983-1694 >> >> >> >> >> ============================================================ >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College >> lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org > > > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org > > ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
