Josh presented this work to us at our of our NIH MIDAS meetings not too long ago. Interesting stuff, but I frankly don't see what all the FRIAMers are so agog about. We've all known for a while that interesting behaviors can be observed from even the most simple A-Life CA simulations (note that is did not use the word "emerge" once in the above sentence. Up until this point, that is).
What befuddles me is how much 'complexity scientists' seem to get off on how simple simulations can sometimes produce interesting results, rather than getting sufficiently cranked up to write *really* big, *really* complex societal models, and to then use them to do *really* big and complex simulation studies. This is not meant to imply any criticism against Josh's work -- it is quite interesting, and he is a very good presenter. It's just that after I see a set of simulation results for a simple simulation of a very simple artificial society, it makes me want to see what a more realistic, higher resolution one can do. I understand Josh's motivations for doing simple simulations. As he states in the article, "the trick [was] to get a lot *out*, while putting in as little as possible", which is cool, sure. To me, however it's all about putting as much in as can be rationally justified, and then turning the crank to see what pops out. Michael A: I agree, this thread would make an interesting WedTech topic. --Doug -- Doug Roberts, RTI International [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 505-455-7333 - Office 505-670-8195 - Cell On 6/27/07, Michael Agar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Good Lord. A shocking line to encounter on arrival in a Florida motel. (That might be a way to start a Carl Hiassen mystery.) Probably the most interesting things that go on in workshops for social/behavioral researchers who know a lot about their area but little about complexity/ABM is in the discussion space between domain knowledge and the concept of an ABM. Don't know what to call it, but it's got something to do with clarity and creativity that feeds back into their domain. This thread would make an interesting Wedtech conversation. Mike >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 06/26/07 7:24 PM >>> Good question - an explanation that's grounded in actual field research I guess. IMHO, an ABM can never offer an explanation for a social behaviour. All it can ever do (and I'm not being dismissive, I think this is important) is offer a suggestion for an explanation that can subsequently be confirmed or denied by real social research/anthropology/enthnological field research program. I don't think this is a particularly strong claim. The logic behind the a sugarscape or Netlogo style ABM seems to be (i) apply some micro rules to checkers running round a checker board, (ii) generate an unexpected macro behaviour, (iii) offer the micro rules as an explanation of the macro rules then (iv) claim that this checker-board behaviour is analagous to behaviour of real people/animals/companies/other real world entities. Step (i) through (iii) are OK (though most ABM papers I see aren't as upfront about the many-to-one nature of the explanation as Carl is in his email) but (iv) strikes me as a bit of a stretch; certainly I'd like more than vague assurances from the researcher that yes it's valid, honest. It doesn't strike me as unreasonable to ask for some evidence that the leap in (iv) is reasonable. But how often do we see that in the literature? As I suggest above, there's plenty of social research techniques that could generate that evidence. But I get the impression that the detailed comparison of model with reality that you get in (say) the Ancestral Pueblo study is the exception rather than the rule. And this is why we need more Mike Agars in this world. Robert ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
