Re: [FRIAM] Rethinking artificial intelligence

[Steve Smith]

More on non-algorithmic computing from Penrose: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emperor's_New_Mind I read this when it was published.   I was interested because I had a dog (more of a lame coyote) in the fight.   I was not very impressed.  And subsequent work in the are did not improve the situation:  Shadows of the Mind (Penrose & Hameroff) Now for my 15 milliseconds of fame: I introduced Penrose and Hameroff in 1984.   Hameroff and I wrote a paper together: (Smith S, Watt RC, Hameroff SR.  Cellular automata in cytoskeletal lattice proteins. Physica D, 1984; 10:l68-l74.) I wrote the Cellular Automata model of cytoskeletal lattice (Microtubulin) and did the parameter studies.   It was an interesting (and unique CA model).    Hameroff was postulating that consciousness was (at least partly) a property of information processing in Microtubules (read the paper for the arguement, some of it IMO was well enough motivated, if a bit of a stretch).   Penrose wrote me to argue the point that consciousness was a nonlinear phenomena and that (perhaps) a key might not be the unique configuration of the geometry/topology of networks of microtubules within nerve cells, but rather (no explanation given) non-repeating patterns such as one would have if they implemented a "Penrose Cellular Automata".   Unfortunately I did not keep the original letter, and I did not respond, much less do the (obvious in retrospect) thing of throwing myself at the great man's feet and immediately writing what would have been "Penrose Life" .    Instead I introduced him  to Hameroff (both seemed kind of balmy to me in my youthful confidence) and moved on. The two immediately bonded over this and went on to develop Orch-OR, a theory of consciousness they call Orchestrated Objective Reduction.   I have never really been able to penetrate it beyond a superficial level. I am, nevertheless interested in anyone's insight into this whole topic...  while I don't give it credence, I haven't been able to dismiss it exactly either. - Steve but I don't see how the brain can use quantum mechanics since it's biochemical and operates on a different scale.  Has anyone read Penrose's book and can recommend it or not (even tho' it was awarded a prize by the Royal Society)? Robert C Robert J. Cordingley wrote: Didn't it take an algorithm (an Inference Engine) to process the heuristics?  Also show me some silicon that doesn't use an algorithm somewhere.  So do you suppose the Mind Machine Project is a way to break free of this computing/algorithmic model? Robert C Pamela McCorduck wrote: Most of early AI was heuristics, not algorithms. Some algorithms were incorporated into expert systems, in the belief that if an algorithm could solve the problem, fine; if not, heuristics might. But it was always *might*. True, computers can't solve all problems, neither can humans. P. "A cold coming we had of it, Just the worst time of the year For a journey, and such a long journey; The ways deep and the weather sharp. The very dead of winter." T.S. Eliot ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org

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FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org