John, 

I am amazed.  I had no idea you were this deep down this rabbit-hole.  

Has anybody out there read Sommerhoff: (sp?) Analyical Biology? About 1950.
Is it relevant?  

 It was concerned with what I am going to call, for want of better terms,
diachronic teloi.  The self aiming gun.  It's diachronic because you get
your idea that the gun is self aiming from observing it over time.  Most of
my writing (and it has just been words, words, words,) has been about
synchronic teloi, synchronic because you get the idea that the birds at
your feeder are designed  from observing several different kinds of birds
at the same moment in [geologic] time.  In my work, I called both of these
forms of "natural design."  (objective teleology).  See also, Powers work
on Control Systems. Also, surprisingly, John Bowlby.  

I originally read Rosen because (1) Carl Tollander put me on to Category
Theory and I thought it might connect our worlds and (2) because I thought
Rosen might lead me to a mathematical characterization of "natural design."

I will be interested in how this conversation develops, even though it is
technologically beyond my ken.  

Nick 

Nicholas S. Thompson
Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology, 
Clark University ([email protected])
http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/
http://www.cusf.org [City University of Santa Fe]




> [Original Message]
> From: John Kennison <[email protected]>
> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[email protected]>
> Date: 4/10/2010 5:21:24 AM
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] invitation + introduction
>
>
>
> Thanks, Grant and Owen, for the votes of confidence. Concerning complex
adaptive systems, I would have to define a CAS in such a way that it can be
interpreted in any topos --then see if we can analyze CAS's by working in a
topos.
>
> Currently I am working on finding cycles. The idea is that we have a
system which can be in different states. Let S be the "set of all states
that the system can be in". Let t:S to S be a "transition function" so that
if the system is now in state x, then, in the next time unit, it will be in
state t(x). I then look for cycles (such as t(a) = b, t(b) = c, t(c) = a,
so that t^3(a)=t(t(t(a)))=a --or, more generally, states x for which
t^n(x)=x for some n, where t^n(x) = t(t(t(     t(x))))))  iterating t n
times. Then I can map the system in "the best possible way" into a topos
where it becomes cyclic, meaning that for every x there is some n with
t^n(x)=x. So n would be a whole number in the topos, but whole numbers can
jump around and be 3 in some places and 5 in other places, etc.
>
> Just exploring this set-up has occupied me since 2001, and I have
published 3 papers on it in the TAC (a web-based journal).
>
> I'll say more and put it in a PDF file, so I  can arrows and exponents
and keep tabbing and spacing the way I intended it.
>
> ---John  
>
>
>
> ________________________________________
> From: [email protected] [[email protected]] On Behalf Of
Grant Holland [[email protected]]
> Sent: Friday, April 09, 2010 5:29 PM
> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] invitation + introduction
>
> John,
>
> I love such clarity - as expressed in your explanation of category
theory. My reaction is "Oh, so THAT's what category theory is!" Thanks for
taking the time to explain.
>
> Grant
>
> John Kennison wrote:
>
> Owen
> Thanks for asking the question. In my answer, below, I describe the
technical terminology impressionistically. If you want more precision, the
Wikipedia articles are usually pretty good at giving precise definitions,
along with some sense of the underlying ideas.
>
> Category theory claims to be a formalization of how mathematics actually
works. For example, consider the following mathematical structures, which
have been defined in the 19th and 20th centuries:
>     Groups =                       “sets with a notion of multiplication”
>     Rings   =                        “sets with notions of both
multiplication and addition”
>     Linear Spaces =          “sets in which vector operations can be
defined”
>     Topological Spaces = “sets with a notion of limit”
> Each structure has a corresponding notion of a structure-preserving
function:
>    Group homomorphism = “function f for which f(xy) = f(x)f(y)”
>    Ring homomorphism = “function f for which f(xy)=f(x)f(y) and
f(x+y)=f(x)+f(y)”
>    Linear map = “function preserving operations such as scalar mult:
f(kv)=kf(v)”
>    Continuous function = “function f for which f(Lim x_n) = Lim(f(x_n)”
>
> A category consists of a class of objects, together with a notion of
“homomorphism” or “map” or “morphism” between these objects. The main
operation in a category is that morphisms compose (given a morphism from X
to Y and another from Y to Z, there is then a composite morphism from X to
Z).
> Examples of catgeories:
>                              Objects = Groups;                Morphisms =
Group Homomorphisms
>                              Objects = Rings;                   Morphisms
= Ring Homomorphisms
>                             Objects = Linear spaces;     Morphisms =
Linear maps
>                             Objects = Top’l spaces;       Morphisms =
Cont. functions
>                             Objects = Sets;                     
Morphisms = Functions
> (The above examples are respectively called the categories of groups, of
rings, of linear spaces, of top’l spaces, and of sets.)
>
> The claimed advantages of using categories are:
> (1)     The important and natural questions that mathematicians ask are
categorical in nature –that is they depend not on operations such as group
multiplication, but strictly on how the morphisms compose. (that is, the
objects are like black boxes, we don't see the limits or multiplication
inside the box, we only see arrows, representing morphisms going from one
box to another.)
> (2)     Looking at a subject from a category-theoretic point of view
sheds light on what is really happening and suggests new research areas.
> (3)     Proving a theorem about an arbitrary category can have
applications to all of the traditional categories mentioned above.
> (4)     As would be expected, there are suitable mappings between
categories, called functors, which enable us to compare and relate
different parts of mathematics.
> I work in topos theory which ambitiously proposes to study where logic
comes from. We start by noting that many ideas in logic are closely tied to
the category of sets.
>         For example the sentence “x > 3” is true for some values of x and
not for others (if we assume, for example, that x is a real number) The
compound sentence “x > 3 and 3x = 12” is true on the intersection of the
set where the x > 3 with the set where 3x = 12.
>         On the other hand, “x >7 or x < 1” in true on a union. Of course
“x not equal to 3” is true on the complement of where “x = 3”.
>         Much of our assumptions about how the logical connectives “and”,
“or”, “not” are closely connected to how intersections, unions and
complements work in sets. But intersections, unions and (weak) complements
can be defined in categorical terms and then they may behave differently
(for example, categories need not obey the “law” of the excluded middle). 
A topos is a category that resembles the category of Sets in some formal
ways, but which may lead to non-standard logics. One example of a topos can
be thought of as a category of sets in which the elements can change over
time, such as the set of all states in the US. Note that the element called
Virginia splits into 2 elements, West Virginia and Virginia, and, according
to some views, elements like Georgia were not in the set of US states
during the Civil War. The set of US states also has structure, such as the
boundaries of the states, which can change over time.
> The advantage of uses toposes is that a traditional mathematical object
can be mapped, using a suitable functor, to a non-standard world (i.e. to a
related object in a topos) and this can reveal some of the inner structure
of the object. For example, an evolving system might be best viewed in a
world where elements can change over time.
>
> ________________________________________
> From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
[[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of
Owen Densmore [[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>]
> Sent: Friday, April 09, 2010 12:50 PM
> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] invitation + introduction
>
> On Apr 7, 2010, at 12:10 PM, John Kennison
<[email protected]><mailto:[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Leigh,
>
> <snip>
> Nick introduced me to Rosen’s “Life Itself” and I have skimmed some
articles by Rosen.  I am both fascinated and disappointed by Rosen’s work.
Fascinated by what Rosen says about the need to develop radically different
kinds of models to deal with biological phenomena and disappointed by
Rosen’s heavy-handed stabs at developing such models. And yet still
stimulated because I have enough ego to believe that with my mathematical
and category-theoretic background, I might succeed where Rosen failed.
>
>
>
> Category theory has been mentioned several times, especially in the early
days of friam. Could you help us out and discuss how it could be applied
here? CT certainly looks fascinating but thus far I've failed to grasp it. 
I'd love a concrete example (like how to address Rosen's world) of it's
use, and possibly a good introduction (book, article).
>
>     ---- Owen
>
>
> I am an iPad, resistance is futile!
> ============================================================
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
>
> ============================================================
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
>
>
>
> ============================================================
> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
> Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
> lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org



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