Hi David, As I review to myself the very little I know about LDS history, it seems to me that the church suffered more at the hands of mobs than it did of governments. Is that true? And if so, where does the distaste for governments arise? And how is a system in which some few elders can deploy the resources of a community as they see fit NOT a government? I keep expecting Jim Gattiker to weigh in. I think he will say something about the hegemony and coercive power of The State. With LDS you can always choose a different religion. So, it's not that you fear governments, it's that you fear SOME governments. And then the question is, what is the difference between governments you fear and those you don't?
Nick Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University [email protected] https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ -----Original Message----- From: Friam <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Prof David West Sent: Saturday, May 16, 2020 11:08 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [FRIAM] from 5/15 virtual FRIAM Topics arose on Friday that I would be interested in pursuing if anyone else shares the interest We briefly talked about story and evocation versus representation I claimed that a words and pictures can be placed on a continuum between representational and evocative. A journal article being closer to representation, poetry closer to evocative. Pictures are more likely to be evocative (although the typical "here I am at the Grand Canyon" pic is mostly representative) because sight dominates our senses and text has to be processed via the left-brain before we can make sense of / react to it. Stories can be fixed on the same spectrum. I have spent a lot of time working with story within the world of software development. Although story has been a constant in software (e.g.UML Use Cases, Agile User Stories) they have been nearly useless because they are representational - requirement capture - in nature and stripped of evocative context. Nick raised the issue of being contrarian with regards science and could get no one to admit to anything beyond ignoring doctor's orders. This conversation also briefly touched on conspiracies and the possibility of a conspiracy without conspirators. My frequent COVID contrariness is, I think, an example of what Nick was looking for. It certainly contains the arrogance of thinking I am better informed with regard relevant data than what is contained in the models and prognostications put forward by the experts. Also, I would assert that the "Deep State" is a real thing, and an exemplar of a conspiracy without conspirators. Thirdly, we talked about charity and the gap between personal and institutional. Contrary to Steve, who noted he grew up absent any kind of religious charitable context, I grew up in a culture where personal charity, awareness, and mutual aid was ubiquitous and constant. Welfare was distributed with every Bishop (roughly equivalent to parish priest - responsible for 100-150 families) had full authority to grant food, clothing, housing, etc. assistance to anyone within his Ward. Social contact, both in church services but also via activities like Family Home Teaching, meant that everyone in the Ward was aware of the needs of everyone else and the Bishop was fully informed as well. When families, even communities, experienced disaster, it was rectified in a matter of days and months. Similar things have been observed in Mennonite and Amish communities. The social system integrated with the LDS religion (or Amish or Mennonite) can provide both the personal and the institutional support, and charity, that will forever elude bureaucratic government. -- --- .-. .-.. --- -.-. -.- ... -..-. .- .-. . -..-. - .... . -..-. . ... ... . -. - .. .- .-.. -..-. .-- --- .-. -.- . .-. ... FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ -- --- .-. .-.. --- -.-. -.- ... -..-. .- .-. . -..-. - .... . -..-. . ... ... . -. - .. .- .-.. -..-. .-- --- .-. -.- . .-. ... FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/
