Re: observer/subject independence - I was reintroduced to this today:

Relational Quantum Mechanics
https://arxiv.org/abs/quant-ph/9609002v2

But going back to separating something like Geometric Unity from a typical Gish 
gallop, this article:

Once again: A misguided article on why the theory of evolution is obsolete
https://whyevolutionistrue.com/2022/06/29/once-again-a-misguided-article-on-why-the-theory-of-evolution-is-obsolete/

is a good response to the Guardian article. I confess to thinking working scientists actually *do* use 
the word "Darwinist" to describe themselves. But I now guess it's an artifact of ... outreach? 
... publicity? ... 
"antidisciplinarity"<https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/08956308.2017.1373047>? 
... whatever you want to call it.


On 10/12/22 19:07, Marcus Daniels wrote:
It makes sense if experimenters are not independent.

On Oct 12, 2022, at 4:03 PM, Roger Critchlow <[email protected]> wrote:


You're following too much click bait, follow only healthy links to substantial 
content and you'll be fine.

-- rec --

On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 3:20 PM Frank Wimberly <[email protected] 
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:

    What a depressing article.  I'm not sure why.

    ---
    Frank C. Wimberly
    140 Calle Ojo Feliz,
    Santa Fe, NM 87505

    505 670-9918
    Santa Fe, NM

    ---------- Forwarded message ---------
    From: *The New York Times* <[email protected] 
<mailto:[email protected]>>
    Date: Wed, Oct 12, 2022, 6:00 AM
    Subject: Black holes may hide an odd secret about our universe
    To: <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>


    __
    Research revealed connections between two views of the cosmos.
    View in browser 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/8bbNlWeJGEy7GiCdZrE2Jw~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP4Q3AWh0dHBzOi8vbWVzc2FnaW5nLWN1c3RvbS1uZXdzbGV0dGVycy5ueXRpbWVzLmNvbS90ZW1wbGF0ZS9vYWt2Mj9jYW1wYWlnbl9pZD0xOTAmZW1jPWVkaXRfdWZuXzIwMjIxMDEyJmluc3RhbmNlX2lkPTc0MzcwJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mcHJvZHVjdENvZGU9VUZOJnJlZ2lfaWQ9NzgzNjE4MTImc2VnbWVudF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MSZ1cmk9bnl0JTNBJTJGJTJGbmV3c2xldHRlciUyRmQxOThjMzcxLTcwZTQtNTVhZi05YmI3LWFkYTYyYmZlNDJkMiZ1c2VyX2lkPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>|nytimes.com
 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/ETBYXA_-FEUmC5uYIzHK8w~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0S-aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vP2NhbXBhaWduX2lkPTE5MCZlbWM9ZWRpdF91Zm5fMjAyMjEwMTImaW5zdGFuY2VfaWQ9NzQzNzAmbmw9dXBkYXRlcy1mcm9tLXRoZS1uZXdzcm9vbSZyZWdpX2lkPTc4MzYxODEyJnNlZ21lbnRfaWQ9MTA5NzI2JnRlPTEmdXNlcl9pZD1mZjY3YzI5ZDAyMmIzNGFkMWFhYTFmNmRkNjQ0ODA3Y1cDbnl0QgpjRV-sRmOVPaWiUhZ3aW1iZXJseTNAYmVya2VsZXkuZWR1WAQAAAAA>
    Continue reading the main story 
<#m_3497075341880264527_m_2986547978703279203_a11y-skip-ad-marquee>
    
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/frsHTHhG3rYOJyioH3U04w~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0RvaHR0cHM6Ly9saXZlaW50ZW50Lm5ld3lvcmt0aW1lc2luZm8uY29tL2NsaWNrP3M9ODU5ODcwJmxpPVVGTiZtPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjJnA9VUZOXzIwMjIxMDEyVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>

    October 12, 2022

    Take gravity, add quantum mechanics, stir. What do you get? A holographic 
cosmos. Maybe.

    OUT THERE

    Article Image

    Leonardo Santamaria

    
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/newsletter/XFYleijQyK1EJ7aJBQHLbg~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0T0aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vMjAyMi8xMC8xMC9zY2llbmNlL2JsYWNrLWhvbGVzLWNvc21vbG9neS1ob2xvZ3JhbS5odG1sP2NhbXBhaWduX2lkPTE5MCZlbWM9ZWRpdF91Zm5fMjAyMjEwMTImaW5zdGFuY2VfaWQ9NzQzNzAmbmw9dXBkYXRlcy1mcm9tLXRoZS1uZXdzcm9vbSZyZWdpX2lkPTc4MzYxODEyJnNlZ21lbnRfaWQ9MTA5NzI2JnRlPTEmdXNlcl9pZD1mZjY3YzI5ZDAyMmIzNGFkMWFhYTFmNmRkNjQ0ODA3Y1cDbnl0QgpjRV-sRmOVPaWiUhZ3aW1iZXJseTNAYmVya2VsZXkuZWR1WAQAAAAA>
      


          Gravity and quantum mechanics have long seemed to have nothing to do 
with each other. Should that be rethought? →

    
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/newsletter/XFYleijQyK1EJ7aJBQHLbg~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0T0aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vMjAyMi8xMC8xMC9zY2llbmNlL2JsYWNrLWhvbGVzLWNvc21vbG9neS1ob2xvZ3JhbS5odG1sP2NhbXBhaWduX2lkPTE5MCZlbWM9ZWRpdF91Zm5fMjAyMjEwMTImaW5zdGFuY2VfaWQ9NzQzNzAmbmw9dXBkYXRlcy1mcm9tLXRoZS1uZXdzcm9vbSZyZWdpX2lkPTc4MzYxODEyJnNlZ21lbnRfaWQ9MTA5NzI2JnRlPTEmdXNlcl9pZD1mZjY3YzI5ZDAyMmIzNGFkMWFhYTFmNmRkNjQ0ODA3Y1cDbnl0QgpjRV-sRmOVPaWiUhZ3aW1iZXJseTNAYmVya2VsZXkuZWR1WAQAAAAA>

    Get stories that capture the wonders of nature, the cosmos and the human 
body.      

    Sign up for Science Times

    Get stories that capture the wonders of nature, the cosmos and the human 
body.

    Get it in your inbox 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/a9RPnakKsrEWbqVLbX1xDw~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TwaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vbmV3c2xldHRlcnM_Y2FtcGFpZ25faWQ9MTkwJmVtYz1lZGl0X3Vmbl8yMDIyMTAxMiZpbnN0YW5jZV9pZD03NDM3MCZuZXdzbGV0dGVyX3NpZ251cD10cnVlJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mcHJvZHVjdF9jb2RlPVNDJnJlZ2lfaWQ9NzgzNjE4MTImc2VnbWVudF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MSZ1c2VyX2lkPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>

    Continue reading the main story 
<#m_3497075341880264527_m_2986547978703279203_a11y-skip-universal-0>

    
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/c5bznirpero7DE9EdGON_A~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0RvaHR0cHM6Ly9saXZlaW50ZW50Lm5ld3lvcmt0aW1lc2luZm8uY29tL2NsaWNrP3M9ODU5Mjk1JmxpPVVGTiZtPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjJnA9VUZOXzIwMjIxMDEyVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>

    Continue reading the main story 
<#m_3497075341880264527_m_2986547978703279203_a11y-skip-tracking_unit-1>

                                

    Need help? Review our newsletter help page 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/mm6p-nu-BlMTJ7glELPiLg~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TpaHR0cHM6Ly9oZWxwLm55dGltZXMuY29tL2hjL2VuLXVzL2FydGljbGVzLzM2MDAwMTQ4ODI2Ni1OZXdzbGV0dGVycz9jYW1wYWlnbl9pZD0xOTAmZW1jPWVkaXRfdWZuXzIwMjIxMDEyJmluc3RhbmNlX2lkPTc0MzcwJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mcmVnaV9pZD03ODM2MTgxMiZzZWdtZW50X2lkPTEwOTcyNiZ0ZT0xJnVzZXJfaWQ9ZmY2N2MyOWQwMjJiMzRhZDFhYWExZjZkZDY0NDgwN2NXA255dEIKY0VfrEZjlT2lolIWd2ltYmVybHkzQGJlcmtlbGV5LmVkdVgEAAAAAA~~>
 or contact us 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/i5ph6s2n7PoK1BNXkqpS7Q~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0ToaHR0cHM6Ly9oZWxwLm55dGltZXMuY29tL2hjL2VuLXVzL2FydGljbGVzLzExNTAxNTM4NTg4Ny1Db250YWN0LXVzP2NhbXBhaWduX2lkPTE5MCZlbWM9ZWRpdF91Zm5fMjAyMjEwMTImaW5zdGFuY2VfaWQ9NzQzNzAmbmw9dXBkYXRlcy1mcm9tLXRoZS1uZXdzcm9vbSZyZWdpX2lkPTc4MzYxODEyJnNlZ21lbnRfaWQ9MTA5NzI2JnRlPTEmdXNlcl9pZD1mZjY3YzI5ZDAyMmIzNGFkMWFhYTFmNmRkNjQ0ODA3Y1cDbnl0QgpjRV-sRmOVPaWiUhZ3aW1iZXJseTNAYmVya2VsZXkuZWR1WAQAAAAA>
 for assistance.

    You received this message because you signed up for updates from The New 
York Times.

    To stop receiving these emails, unsubscribe 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/jM3lRX3jiEIoss50nNCK5Q~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TZaHR0cHM6Ly9teWFjY291bnQubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vc2VnL3Vuc3Vic2NyaWJlL1VGTi80OGQ4YWIxZDIwZGQ2Y2FmNDhmNTk0YjZhY2I0YjBmYzM4ZWM2OTI0ZGE1OGI5NTFlMDY4NmZkMzAwOWVjYWY0YzhhYjcwNTI3YTU2NDg5YWMzY2NkZDJjMzk5NDgzMDQ_ZW1jPWVkaXRfdWZuXzIwMjIxMDEyJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mc2VuZF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MVcDbnl0QgpjRV-sRmOVPaWiUhZ3aW1iZXJseTNAYmVya2VsZXkuZWR1WAQAAAAA>
 or manage your email preferences 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/8ExngxiPUmOVoQuXwgtftQ~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TDaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vZW1haWw_Y2FtcGFpZ25faWQ9MTkwJmVtYz1lZGl0X3Vmbl8yMDIyMTAxMiZpbnN0YW5jZV9pZD03NDM3MCZubD11cGRhdGVzLWZyb20tdGhlLW5ld3Nyb29tJnJlZ2lfaWQ9NzgzNjE4MTImc2VnbWVudF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MSZ1c2VyX2lkPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>.

    Subscribe to The Times 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/9xB5yyes-lEKGo_2WtEU8A~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TbaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vc3Vic2NyaXB0aW9uP2NhbXBhaWduSWQ9OVJYNzgmY2FtcGFpZ25faWQ9MTkwJmVtYz1lZGl0X3Vmbl8yMDIyMTAxMiZpbnN0YW5jZV9pZD03NDM3MCZubD11cGRhdGVzLWZyb20tdGhlLW5ld3Nyb29tJnJlZ2lfaWQ9NzgzNjE4MTImc2VnbWVudF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MSZ1c2VyX2lkPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>Get
 The New York Times app 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/sK9_4_pM0Q34w1NnU_wCkw~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TYaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vc2VydmljZXMvbW9iaWxlL2luZGV4Lmh0bWw_Y2FtcGFpZ25faWQ9MTkwJmVtYz1lZGl0X3Vmbl8yMDIyMTAxMiZpbnN0YW5jZV9pZD03NDM3MCZubD11cGRhdGVzLWZyb20tdGhlLW5ld3Nyb29tJnJlZ2lfaWQ9NzgzNjE4MTImc2VnbWVudF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MSZ1c2VyX2lkPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>

    Connect with us on:

        facebook 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/cu49QttJEPyxudGx76XIKQ~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TGaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZmFjZWJvb2suY29tL255dGltZXM_Y2FtcGFpZ25faWQ9MTkwJmVtYz1lZGl0X3Vmbl8yMDIyMTAxMiZpbnN0YW5jZV9pZD03NDM3MCZubD11cGRhdGVzLWZyb20tdGhlLW5ld3Nyb29tJnJlZ2lfaWQ9NzgzNjE4MTImc2VnbWVudF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MSZ1c2VyX2lkPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>
      twitter 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/FtycKam5cSWGYxnNxi1iKg~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TBaHR0cHM6Ly90d2l0dGVyLmNvbS9ueXRpbWVzP2NhbXBhaWduX2lkPTE5MCZlbWM9ZWRpdF91Zm5fMjAyMjEwMTImaW5zdGFuY2VfaWQ9NzQzNzAmbmw9dXBkYXRlcy1mcm9tLXRoZS1uZXdzcm9vbSZyZWdpX2lkPTc4MzYxODEyJnNlZ21lbnRfaWQ9MTA5NzI2JnRlPTEmdXNlcl9pZD1mZjY3YzI5ZDAyMmIzNGFkMWFhYTFmNmRkNjQ0ODA3Y1cDbnl0QgpjRV-sRmOVPaWiUhZ3aW1iZXJseTNAYmVya2VsZXkuZWR1WAQAAAAA>
       instagram
    
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/FbxNgxlEed4SMhw14RehAA~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TIaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaW5zdGFncmFtLmNvbS9ueXRpbWVzLz9jYW1wYWlnbl9pZD0xOTAmZW1jPWVkaXRfdWZuXzIwMjIxMDEyJmluc3RhbmNlX2lkPTc0MzcwJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mcmVnaV9pZD03ODM2MTgxMiZzZWdtZW50X2lkPTEwOTcyNiZ0ZT0xJnVzZXJfaWQ9ZmY2N2MyOWQwMjJiMzRhZDFhYWExZjZkZDY0NDgwN2NXA255dEIKY0VfrEZjlT2lolIWd2ltYmVybHkzQGJlcmtlbGV5LmVkdVgEAAAAAA~~>

    Change Your Email 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/w4X-7iT1g-vqxRG-zFOqjg~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TSaHR0cHM6Ly9teWFjY291bnQubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vbWVtL2VtYWlsLmh0bWw_Y2FtcGFpZ25faWQ9MTkwJmVtYz1lZGl0X3Vmbl8yMDIyMTAxMiZpbnN0YW5jZV9pZD03NDM3MCZubD11cGRhdGVzLWZyb20tdGhlLW5ld3Nyb29tJnJlZ2lfaWQ9NzgzNjE4MTImc2VnbWVudF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MSZ1c2VyX2lkPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>Privacy
 Policy 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/irKSjaBN1zviaUC__tyKCw~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TzaHR0cDovL3d3dy5ueXRpbWVzLmNvbS9jb250ZW50L2hlbHAvcmlnaHRzL3ByaXZhY3kvcG9saWN5L3ByaXZhY3ktcG9saWN5Lmh0bWw_Y2FtcGFpZ25faWQ9MTkwJmVtYz1lZGl0X3Vmbl8yMDIyMTAxMiZpbnN0YW5jZV9pZD03NDM3MCZubD11cGRhdGVzLWZyb20tdGhlLW5ld3Nyb29tJnJlZ2lfaWQ9NzgzNjE4MTImc2VnbWVudF9pZD0xMDk3MjYmdGU9MSZ1c2VyX2lkPWZmNjdjMjlkMDIyYjM0YWQxYWFhMWY2ZGQ2NDQ4MDdjVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>Contact
 Us
    
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/lQLHLxzS1Uo0Lm-BqXut0g~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TaaHR0cHM6Ly9teWFjY291bnQubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vbWVtYmVyY2VudGVyL2hlbHAuaHRtbD9jYW1wYWlnbl9pZD0xOTAmZW1jPWVkaXRfdWZuXzIwMjIxMDEyJmluc3RhbmNlX2lkPTc0MzcwJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mcmVnaV9pZD03ODM2MTgxMiZzZWdtZW50X2lkPTEwOTcyNiZ0ZT0xJnVzZXJfaWQ9ZmY2N2MyOWQwMjJiMzRhZDFhYWExZjZkZDY0NDgwN2NXA255dEIKY0VfrEZjlT2lolIWd2ltYmVybHkzQGJlcmtlbGV5LmVkdVgEAAAAAA~~>California
 Notices 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/3YPW9NLPPL885EkK3VEmzg~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0TXaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubnl0aW1lcy5jb20vcHJpdmFjeS9jYWxpZm9ybmlhLW5vdGljZT9jYW1wYWlnbl9pZD0xOTAmZW1jPWVkaXRfdWZuXzIwMjIxMDEyJmluc3RhbmNlX2lkPTc0MzcwJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mcmVnaV9pZD03ODM2MTgxMiZzZWdtZW50X2lkPTEwOTcyNiZ0ZT0xJnVzZXJfaWQ9ZmY2N2MyOWQwMjJiMzRhZDFhYWExZjZkZDY0NDgwN2NXA255dEIKY0VfrEZjlT2lolIWd2ltYmVybHkzQGJlcmtlbGV5LmVkdVgEAAAAAA~~>

    LiveIntent Logo 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/zXYfCvY6pYoUTPsuBhK2iQ~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0RdaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubGl2ZWludGVudC5jb20vcG93ZXJlZC1ieT90ZT0xJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mZW1jPWVkaXRfdWZuXzIwMjIxMDEyVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>AdChoices
 Logo 
<https://nl.nytimes.com/f/a/2vLN-yPHdMB7Mk4LeO-uZw~~/AAAAAQA~/RgRlKTFfP0RdaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cubGl2ZWludGVudC5jb20vYWQtY2hvaWNlcz90ZT0xJm5sPXVwZGF0ZXMtZnJvbS10aGUtbmV3c3Jvb20mZW1jPWVkaXRfdWZuXzIwMjIxMDEyVwNueXRCCmNFX6xGY5U9paJSFndpbWJlcmx5M0BiZXJrZWxleS5lZHVYBAAAAAA~>

    The New York Times Company. 620 Eighth Avenue New York, NY 10018

--
ꙮ Mɥǝu ǝlǝdɥɐuʇs ɟᴉƃɥʇ' ʇɥǝ ƃɹɐss snɟɟǝɹs˙ ꙮ

-. --- - / ...- .- .-.. .. -.. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. .
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe   /   Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom 
https://bit.ly/virtualfriam
to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/
archives:  5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/
 1/2003 thru 6/2021  http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/

Reply via email to