I hope I am sticking to the thread, hermeneutically ... Assume three groups: one speaks, thinks, and dreams in Babel-17; another in Adamic (aka "language of the birds"); and the vastly larger group only in *"appetites."*
The Babel-17 folks are very clever and have used their language to express many wondrous things, including machines that, mostly, convincingly replicate Babel-17 expressiveness. Smitten with their cleverness and power, they look down on, with at least a modicum of justification, the larger crowd, the "Appetite-istas." The fears, concerns, and even the lack of wealth required to possess the means to access and play with Babel-17, are grounds for condemning them to the trash heap of history. What is interesting to me, is the seemingly absolute conviction that Babel-17 is the ultimate and the only way to speak, think, dream. If the Adamic folk are noticed at all, they are immediately and scornfully dismissed as irrelevant, or worse. davew [Babel-17 is an SF novel by Samuel R. Delany] On Wed, Nov 26, 2025, at 11:53 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > The moral failing is letting the fog of fear take over, and fabricating any > story that seems to work to rationalize it. The hate and fear of immigrants > on the blue collar side is giving way to hate and fear of AI on the white > collar side. > > *From: *Friam <[email protected]> on behalf of glen > <[email protected]> > *Date: *Wednesday, November 26, 2025 at 9:00 AM > *To: *[email protected] <[email protected]> > *Subject: *Re: [FRIAM] mental imagery > I love that we're sticking to the thread, but in a hermeneutic way. An > inability to envision is akin to an inability execute Lean 4 code. If you > don't have the hardware, you can't run the computation. The same could be > said about entitled college students or the poor sods who've never benefited > from a hero dose of Ψ. I credit Fanon for teaching me that relatively vapid > things like the No Kings protest are inadequate for the victims of genocide. > Perhaps Israel was destined to be genocidal. "For if the last shall be first, > this will only come to pass after a murderous and decisive struggle between > the two protagonists." > > Steve's use of "conceit" often confuses me. If I replace it with "controlling > idea" ... or, better, "occult controlling idea", then it seems like agency is > *the* conceit of our modern times. Framing one's inability to compute as a > moral failing feels akin to blaming the victim. But what choice do we have? > We absolutely must, and always do, blame the victim. Right? If you're > aphantasic, then it's clearly because you're too lazy to put in the effort. > > On 11/26/25 8:23 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > > Rather the IP has some defensive function at the population level for > > protecting valuable things from a population that values nothing beyond > > their own comfort. > > On 11/26/25 8:15 AM, Jon Zingale wrote: > > I mean, yeah, preach on. For some it's nothing more than a Holiday in > > Cambodia. > > On 11/26/25 7:53 AM, Steve Smith wrote: > > On the other hand, we might (also?) just be apes picking nits out of one > > another's furry thoughts? Which is it's own mode of coercion/engagement? > -- > ¡sıɹƎ ןıɐH ⊥ ɐןןǝdoɹ ǝ uǝןƃ > ὅτε oi μὲν ἄλλοι κύνες τοὺς ἐχϑροὺς δάκνουσιν, ἐγὰ δὲ τοὺς φίλους, ἵνα σώσω. > .- .-.. .-.. / ..-. --- --- - . .-. ... / .- .-. . / .-- .-. --- -. --. / ... > --- -- . / .- .-. . / ..- ... . ..-. ..- .-.. > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom > https://bit.ly/virtualfriam > to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: 5/2017 thru present > https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ > > > *Attachments:* > • smime.p7s
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