It’s why languages like Lean 4 are popular now for AI:  Make the AI prove 
correctness.    It may fail, but then one knows not to use that code. 

 

From: Friam <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Gillian Densmore
Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2026 3:35 PM
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] What is FRIAM and is it still alive

 

vibe coding is as gamers used to say for l4m3rz: did ya' ebay yourself: subtle 
logic problems or even just not real coode with a tone of emoji's slips in. 

_worse_is when its tokens or something happens it's not quite true 
hallucination, but pretty close, or just wrong. A minor example: I know a 
little about Kava. and depending chatgpt temperature rating the answers can be: 
sort of right. or just wrong and occasional dangerous. For example I'm almost 
50 and that's about when it's a little dicy in the us to have kava without 
getting boring rambling:its because it inclue arial bits and leaves stuff that 
isn't all that great anyway and super hard on your liver. Well Sometimes chagpt 
says that is fine. (oops)That is a problem for coding. The code (to me) might 
look good: but Steve or Josh might look and  be horrified at: anything from not 
well formatted to logic bombs or national obfuscation etc.  that's why asking 
ChatGPT to code for you is bad. and it's called "vibecoding" 

Just imagine me navely thinking i'm helping because I found a bug in 
cool_code_here.  and I go oh hey I kind of reconise this problem then ask 
clause or grok etc. and--what happens if: to me, it looks like a reasonable 
patch or whatever: but to someone who actually Knows that programing language: 
it's just terrible. that's the huge problem with vibecoded stuff getting into 
the wild.

 

 

On Wed, Aug 12, 2026 at 4:26 PM Owen Densmore <[email protected] 
<mailto:[email protected]> > wrote:

I just did the same stunt with chatgpt. It's output was:

 

This site is a public web archive of the FRIAM email discussion list. It 
displays messages grouped into conversational threads, with links to older 
posts.

The community appears to be centered around Santa Fe and brings together people 
interested in science, technology, mathematics, philosophy, and complex 
systems. Recent discussions include:

*       Artificial intelligence, cognitive offloading, semantic networks, and 
“vibe coding”
*       Software development, Linux, and technical troubleshooting
*       Mathematics and research, including solutions to \(A^4+B^4+C^4=D^4\)
*       Philosophy, agency, reasoning, and scientific criticism
*       Synthetic life, geology, archaeology, electric vehicles, and space 
exploration
*       Local Santa Fe meetups, especially gatherings at St. John’s or nearby 
cafés
*       Community announcements, obituaries, shared articles, and informal 
conversation

The tone is eclectic and conversational: serious technical or philosophical 
debate sits alongside local coordination, jokes, provocative subject lines, and 
requests for help. A relatively small group of recurring contributors produces 
much of the activity, often through long reply chains.

In short, it’s less a conventional informational website than a browsable 
record of an active intellectual community’s mailing-list conversations.

 

 

On Wed, Aug 12, 2026 at 3:41 PM Owen Densmore <[email protected] 
<mailto:[email protected]> > wrote:

I just looked at our archive here: 

https://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/index.html

I then used the chrome claude extension and asked a simple prompt:

give me a summary of this site

It came up with:

 

This page is the Mail Archive's index for the FRIAM mailing list 
([email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> ), archived at mail-archive.com 
<http://mail-archive.com> .

FRIAM stands for "Friday Applications in Complexity," a long-running discussion 
group/mailing list associated with people connected to the Santa Fe Institute 
and Santa Fe, New Mexico complexity science community. The archive displays 
messages organized by thread, showing a chronological/threaded index of email 
conversations rather than any original content of its own.

Looking at the thread titles, the list is an informal, freewheeling discussion 
forum where members debate a wide mix of topics: philosophy of mind (e.g. "phil 
zombies," "group agency"), math puzzles (several threads on the equation 
A⁴+B⁴+C⁴=D⁴), AI and technology commentary ("vibe coding," "AI Slop," 
"cognitive offloading"), software/Linux questions, local Santa Fe meetup 
logistics (coffee shop and venue announcements like "St John's" or "New Santa 
Fe Baking"), obituaries and memorials for community members, and general banter 
among a recurring group of participants such as glen, Marcus Daniels, Steve 
Smith, Tom Johnson, Frank Wimberly, and others.

In short, it's a public email archive of a niche, long-running community 
mailing list mixing casual meetup coordination with intellectual discussion on 
complexity science, AI, math, and philosophy.

Kinda fun sicking AI on our past.

 

    -- Owen

 

.- .-.. .-.. / ..-. --- --- - . .-. ... / .- .-. . / .-- .-. --- -. --. / ... 
--- -- . / .- .-. . / ..- ... . ..-. ..- .-..
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe   /   Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom 
https://bit.ly/virtualfriam
to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/
archives:  5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/
  1/2003 thru 6/2021  http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/

Attachment: smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature

.- .-.. .-.. / ..-. --- --- - . .-. ... / .- .-. . / .-- .-. --- -. --. / ... 
--- -- . / .- .-. . / ..- ... . ..-. ..- .-..
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe   /   Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom 
https://bit.ly/virtualfriam
to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com
FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/
archives:  5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/
  1/2003 thru 6/2021  http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/

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