Oh, I'm sorry having sent you that link, apparently I have it in the
exception list ...
However, you can get the current handbook from github if you are interested:
https://github.com/gheber/kenzo/raw/master/doc/Kenzo-Doc.pdf
https://github.com/gheber/kenzo

You'll find the examples on page 66 ff.
Concerning ordering you're right that it may be depending on implementation
(but this has to be clearly documented, e.g. implicit ordering).. My
understanding is that we either are dealing with vertex sets (as Waldek
suggested) or otherwise, if explicit orientation is a concern then we ought
to use chains, e.g. integer chains [1,2]=-[2,1].

Kurt




On 19 September 2016 at 17:37, Martin Baker <ax87...@martinb.com> wrote:

> On 19/09/16 12:00, Ralf Hemmecke wrote:
>
>> I can only speak for firefox, but you should note that forging a http
>> connection is easier than forging a https connection.
>>
>> If you allow Firefox to do an exception for the above site (note that
>> you don't need to accept that exception "permanently" -- deselect the
>> checkbox), it means that you connect to the site in an encrytped way. So
>> the connection to the target site is encrypted, the only thing that you
>> don't know is that the site is the site it claims to be and that nobody
>> has led you to a wrong site. With http, you neither have encryption nor
>> can you be sure that someone led you to the wrong site.
>>
>> As I see it, this sites certificate simply has expired. So it would
>> probably be a good thing to tell thit to the webmaster of
>> www-fourier.ujf-grenoble.fr.
>>
>> As long as you trust that the .pdf does not have a virus, I think, it's
>> not a problem if one trusts "self-signed certificates". Although
>> nowadays people should probably switch to "Let's encrypt"-certificates.
>> https://letsencrypt.org/
>>
>> Ralf
>>
>
> OK, thanks, I'll do that.
>
>
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