On Sat, Jul 07, 2012 at 03:45:37PM +0200, Henry Jensen wrote: > Hello, > > On Fri, 6 Jul 2012 22:13:52 +0200 (CEST) > Thorsten Alteholz <[email protected]> wrote: > > > I understand that distributing non-free software is a problem. But why is > > Debian non-free just by mentioning or linking to non-free-software? > > Every free GNU/Linux dotro which wants to be listed at the free diostro > list mus follow the Free System Distribution Guidelines (FSD) [1] THe > FSDG clearly states > > "A free system distribution must not steer users towards obtaining any > nonfree information for practical use, or encourage them to do so." > > So, every explicit mentioning of non-free software could be interpreted > as recommendation. > > It goes even further: > > "All the documentation in a free system distribution must be released > under an appropriate free license. Additionally, it must take care not > to recommend nonfree software." > > So, I see that the following problems must be solved by Debian to be > listed as a free distro: > > - The Debian kernel still is a problem, because it contains the names > of non-free firmware files. The kernel prints the name of the firmware > file to the log if it doesn't find the file. This is a case of > recommendation of installing non-free software and therefore a > violation of the FSDG. The only Linux kernel variant that does not do > this is GNU Linux-Libre [2]. So Debian must use GNU Linux-Libre or > delete the name of firmware files in the Debian kernel. > > - There are some free software which recommends non-free software. The > perhaps most popular software is Firefox, which connects to > addons.mozilla.org which lists non-ree plugins. So does Debians > Iceweasel. So Debian must remove this recommendations from it's > software (e. g. use GNU Icecat or patch Iceweasel accordingly)
We should also block nonfree websites, like gmail, google, yahoo. > > - All mentioning of non-free software, including contrib and non-free > repo, must be purged from all official Debian web sites, including wiki > sites. > > - In the official Debian forums and mailing lists, there shouldn't be > any advice how to run a non-free program, see [3]. So, if any user asks > how to run a non-free program on a Debian mailing list, it should be > clarified that such discussions are unwanted. That means, that some > kind of moderation should be established to be sure, that such unwanted > advices or recommendations doesn't happen. > IMHO this is getting absurd. There is non-free software, our users will use it, and pretending it doesn't exist is a pretty bad idea. We can provide unofficial support for such things *outside* the project (as it currently is), but draw the line more clearly. Heck, non-free won't get built on the same buildds as main. To be absolutely clear - I've never sponsored or worked on non-free code, but I understand why it exists. > > Regards, > > Henry > > > [1] http://www.gnu.org/distros/free-system-distribution-guidelines > [2] http://www.fsfla.org/svnwiki/selibre/linux-libre/ > [3] http://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/gnu-linux-libre/2010-12/msg00032.html > > _______________________________________________ > Fsf-collab-discuss mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/fsf-collab-discuss I understand your point, I just don't think putting our fingers in our ears and yelling "lalalalala" is going to solve anything. We should *educate* users to make big-boy and girl decisions. -Paul -- .''`. Paul Tagliamonte <[email protected]> : :' : Proud Debian Developer `. `'` 4096R / 8F04 9AD8 2C92 066C 7352 D28A 7B58 5B30 807C 2A87 `- http://people.debian.org/~paultag
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