indeed :) but, it is how a proper anon person would operate, well, tht is how i once did... anyhow, it is to broad, and, yes, i qwould never believe in bulletproof, unless i have used it maybe, for 10yrs, thru 10 botnets ;P wich, is very rare but funnily, possible. webhosters, are even more corrupt and better at hiding data.. face it, if the vpn provider had not shat themself, then it would be a non story.
On 29 September 2011 23:00, Benji <[email protected]> wrote: > 'Abuse' emails and court orders are very different. > > On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 1:59 PM, xD 0x41 <[email protected]> wrote: > >> err, you are limited in those countries dude... id really checkup on that >> ... maybe some but, yea i agree, i dont think any hosting is anon, but, i >> sure know i have kept an anon dedis in past, and was VERY easy to avoid >> handing anything over. Unless they had personally seized from my company, i >> was allowed to basically get away with, and if i want to, again, could do >> the same 'anonymously' and, indeed keep those details, away. >> it is not frigin hard dude, where did Yyou get the idea, that is not hard >> to move a user around boxes :P >> and rename them, etc etc etc, always change ipv6 tunnels... there is >> somany ways, you obv have not ran a dedicated server in a company >> environment coz boi, they hide nets on legit hostin now, legit apparently* >> companies...and they do it using those simple means, and, even show logs of >> them 'removing and deleting' files of the apprent 'bad user' , this is, a >> whole different level than even needing to deal with cops.. so, you are >> scared too much by laws wich can be smokescreened. >> Run a dedis, or simply ask a admin, howmany abuse they get, and howmany >> users they actually rm ;) >> you would want this service, on your vps ? >> i surely wouldnt,. i know, with me, if i offer anon, you stay damn anon, >> if you bring cops to MY HOUSE, then i may have to try and, simply keep my >> darn data secure ey ? >> how about that ? >> simple methods, defeat simple plans benji. >> xd >> >> >> >> On 29 September 2011 22:53, Benji <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Yes they do. If you buy a server in America for example, even if you are >>> located in Russia, they are required by federal law to hand over your >>> details wherever you may reside. I dont know where you've obtained this idea >>> that they can't. >>> >>> Just because something is advertised as 'anonymous' doesnt mean it's 'so >>> anonymous you can break the law' and anyone using a EU/US-related country to >>> do this is either stupid or naive. >>> >>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 1:50 PM, xD 0x41 <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> They advertised as anonymous VPN to 'everyone'. >>>> Then, that would mean, especially NOT locally, thats something wich is >>>> also, subject to federal laws though so, in its own country, the provider >>>> may have to, nomatter whats advertised, BUT outside of country customers, >>>> should not be handed over. >>>> isp's here dont do it, and havent, for like 20 yrs, they also do not >>>> take down people,issue nor execute other peoples 'takedown orders', there >>>> is >>>> many reasons for this but basically, they loose money from it. >>>> Anyhow, in UK, you maybe right, but outside of there, then, they should >>>> have maybe not advertised as anononymous vpn services for everyone and >>>> anyone. thats obvious crap we know now. >>>> anyhow, cheers, >>>> xd >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 29 September 2011 22:45, Benji <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Im sorry, why is it 'worrying' that a vpn provider that was a UK >>>>> business and was located in the UK, is subject to UK law? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 9:51 AM, Darren Martyn < >>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Again, I hope this does not fail to send. >>>>>> The reasoning behind the "Pure Elite" recruitment channel was A: to >>>>>> recruit some talented people (and, by all accounts, there were some >>>>>> talented >>>>>> programmers there) and B: development and idle talk. Now more interesting >>>>>> was the reasoning behind the name - by putting the developers and coders >>>>>> and >>>>>> potential recruits in a channel named "Pure Elite", it was essentially an >>>>>> ego boost for the new guys, made them feel valued, etc, when in fact most >>>>>> were but pawns to be used (IMHO). >>>>>> >>>>>> This co-operation between VPN providers and LEO, while being nothing >>>>>> new - remember how hushmail caved in - is indeed worrying for those of us >>>>>> who are privacy advocates as well as security researchers. >>>>>> >>>>>> On a more direct note, Laurelei, do not presume that you know all >>>>>> there is to know about them. Doing so would be foolish. (Now don't go >>>>>> assuming that I hate you, I bear you bugger all ill-will, etc). >>>>>> Good day. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Sep 28, 2011 at 5:44 AM, Laurelai Storm < >>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Its all good dude. What really concerns me is that vpn providers >>>>>>> might give over logs to oppressive regemes. TOR is starting to look >>>>>>> better >>>>>>> and better. >>>>>>> On Sep 27, 2011 11:40 PM, "GloW - XD" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> > never did... was only for one buttcheek kid that i was alittle >>>>>>> pissed and >>>>>>> > thinking things wich, prolly were wrong at the time... >>>>>>> > I am adult enough to apologise for what happened back then, and >>>>>>> hopefully it >>>>>>> > is just, cool. >>>>>>> > :) >>>>>>> > cheers, your loved by many, you just have many trollers to :sp >>>>>>> > take care , >>>>>>> > xd >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > On 28 September 2011 14:32, Laurelai Storm <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> >> Im suprised, someone on the internet who *doesn't * hate me :p >>>>>>> >> On Sep 27, 2011 11:29 PM, "GloW - XD" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >> > Hello Laurelai , >>>>>>> >> > Oh i agree it is still a terrible precedent to be set.. I dont >>>>>>> even know >>>>>>> >> > where, legally, i stand anymore... >>>>>>> >> > It is rather disturbing, nomatter WHO it was laurela. >>>>>>> >> > I am all for the hatred against the VPN provs, and this is not >>>>>>> just >>>>>>> >> > happening here, and i made a BIG statement about this, and >>>>>>> privacy, in my >>>>>>> >> > channel on efnet, first as i saw it. >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > Then saw a torrentfreak feed,of someone who was an owner of a >>>>>>> huge >>>>>>> >> torrent >>>>>>> >> > site, was handed to authorities, not by the hoster, no... but by >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> >> > frigging payment handler, ie paypal or alertpay most likely. >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > This is not good, it makes a grey could now over what is 'anon' >>>>>>> and what >>>>>>> >> > isnt. and thats a bad thing for us all. >>>>>>> >> > To much fraud is causing this, thats plain and simple.Abusing >>>>>>> places like >>>>>>> >> > Sony, and, major banks, only make the authorities turn to >>>>>>> politics, whom >>>>>>> >> in >>>>>>> >> > turn can bully with federal and state laws of ANY country, i >>>>>>> think this >>>>>>> >> is >>>>>>> >> > the dangerous part wich is affecting lulzsec members or whoever >>>>>>> was apart >>>>>>> >> of >>>>>>> >> > it, and, i mean efnet is no recruiting grounds for decent hkrs. >>>>>>> >> > Simple as that, you know it, maybe thru word of mouth ok, but >>>>>>> not alone >>>>>>> >> by >>>>>>> >> > being in channels but that network, is one federal hideout >>>>>>> now..and, that >>>>>>> >> is >>>>>>> >> > every channel, if it is not being spied (yea they have a module >>>>>>> >> > m_spychannel.c or similar, wich, they actually had without >>>>>>> realising, >>>>>>> >> asked >>>>>>> >> > a friend, to code for them. >>>>>>> >> > This was rejected by me/her,but i believe they have the module >>>>>>> running >>>>>>> >> now. >>>>>>> >> > So, what was to stop them adding theyre own hidden spy mode to >>>>>>> it :s look >>>>>>> >> at >>>>>>> >> > what they did to my old channel #haqnet, they introduced >>>>>>> drinemon and a >>>>>>> >> > bunch of other things, when it could have been simply worked out >>>>>>> with >>>>>>> >> > words.. but anyhow, i will not brood on the past, i hope this is >>>>>>> mutual >>>>>>> >> > Laurelai, I have nothing bad to say about you, and in turn, >>>>>>> expect the >>>>>>> >> same. >>>>>>> >> > Respect for respect dear. >>>>>>> >> > I do agree with you about the situation and, as you can see, am >>>>>>> not >>>>>>> >> holding >>>>>>> >> > 9undisclosed) crappy things wich happened along time ago, over >>>>>>> one >>>>>>> >> idiotic >>>>>>> >> > kid, on efnet, whom now i know you do not associate with. So, i >>>>>>> want >>>>>>> >> that, >>>>>>> >> > to be laid rest now.. please. >>>>>>> >> > And, we can only hope that the greater common sense will prevail >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> >> > hopefully, places will be forced to proove anonymity in some >>>>>>> way, wether >>>>>>> >> > that be by showing people email interaction with requester's of >>>>>>> peoples >>>>>>> >> > info, or anything simple even, wich would be then a standard for >>>>>>> VPN, I >>>>>>> >> do >>>>>>> >> > not use them but, if i bought anonymous vpn, id expect exactly >>>>>>> >> that,without >>>>>>> >> > political interaction and grey areas about who and what is now >>>>>>> legal and >>>>>>> >> not >>>>>>> >> > legal on the internet, on chatrooms, and on even websites. >>>>>>> >> > ok, thats plenty, cheers! >>>>>>> >> > xd >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > On 28 September 2011 13:41, Laurelai <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> On 9/27/2011 10:10 PM, sandeep k wrote: >>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> Lolz members was really insane ,i m not why to use that crapy >>>>>>> hma. >>>>>>> >> >> On Sep 27, 2011 8:36 PM, "Ferenc Kovacs" <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >> >> > yeah, and usually the same goes for calling others "kids" ;) >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 10:30 PM, GloW - XD < >>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >> >> >> #pure-elite , rofl... yes indeed :P >>>>>>> >> >> >> hehe... nice story tho...funny about the elite channel >>>>>>> thing... why >>>>>>> >> do >>>>>>> >> >> ppl >>>>>>> >> >> >> tag themselves as elite? usually when they are not... >>>>>>> >> >> >> ohwell, thats efnut :s (irc sucks) >>>>>>> >> >> >> xd >>>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> >> On 27 September 2011 19:03, Darren Martyn >>>>>>> >> >> >> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>>> >> >> >>> Hope this sends correctly, new email client and all... But >>>>>>> seeing as >>>>>>> >> it >>>>>>> >> >> is >>>>>>> >> >> >>> an international investigation many people have been >>>>>>> bending over >>>>>>> >> >> backwards >>>>>>> >> >> >>> to assist LEO on this. HMA and perfect privacy were the >>>>>>> VPN's of >>>>>>> >> choice >>>>>>> >> >> for >>>>>>> >> >> >>> them it would appear, oh, and he was part of the >>>>>>> #pure-elite channel >>>>>>> >> on >>>>>>> >> >> that >>>>>>> >> >> >>> IRC server, and hence, considered by LEO and others as >>>>>>> "Part of >>>>>>> >> >> LulzSec". >>>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>>> >> >> >>> TL;DR, this is nothing new. >>>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>>> >> >> >>> On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 6:53 AM, Laurelai Storm < >>>>>>> >> [email protected] >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> >>> wrote: >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> And the guy wasnt even a part of lulzsec >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> On Sep 26, 2011 10:37 PM, "Jeffrey Walton" < >>>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>>> >> >> wrote: >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > On Mon, Sep 26, 2011 at 8:47 PM, Ivan . < >>>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>>> >> wrote: >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> >> >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> >> >>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/VPN-provider-helped-track-down-alleged-LulzSec-member-1349666.html >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Though HMA claims they complied with a court order, it >>>>>>> looks as >>>>>>> >> if >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > they facilitated a law enforcement request. The US and >>>>>>> the FBI >>>>>>> >> have >>>>>>> >> >> no >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > jurisdiction in the UK. >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Jeff >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Charter: >>>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> > Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> Charter: >>>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>>> >> >> >>>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>>> >> >> >>> >>>>>>> >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >> >> >>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>>> >> >> >>> Charter: >>>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>>> >> >> >>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >> >> >> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>>> >> >> >> Charter: >>>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>>> >> >> >> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>>> >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > -- >>>>>>> >> >> > Ferenc Kovács >>>>>>> >> >> > @Tyr43l - http://tyrael.hu >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >> >> > Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>>> >> >> > Charter: >>>>>>> http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>>> >> >> > Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >> >> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>>> >> >> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>>> >> >> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> >From my understanding they used the channel as a possible >>>>>>> recruitment >>>>>>> >> >> ground, though only 6 people were officially a part of lulzsec >>>>>>> , i find >>>>>>> >> it >>>>>>> >> >> disturbing that law enforcement considers being in an irc >>>>>>> channel >>>>>>> >> tantamount >>>>>>> >> >> to being a part of lulzsec. >>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >> >> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>>> >> >> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>>> >> >> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>>> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>>> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. >>>>> Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html >>>>> Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >
_______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
