Harry, you have several times repeated your 'operating rule', but the problem with it is that you do do quite a bit of harm, for example, with your insensitivity to the poor, and your ready acceptance of the market place as the ultimate arbiter of what is good and bad, and your inability to see past the domain of economics when you address what is important to people.
To quote something from FDR: "The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much, it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little." Until, in my opinion, you can find some way of rising to this challenge, your thoughts on society and economics will always lack something vital. And, to return to the immediate topic, that one can find an operating rule that 'doesn't have to change much' does not mean that others do not. It is toward this that is what I would like to see you direct your attention. Cheers, Lawry -----Original Message----- From: Harry Pollard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 6:15 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [email protected] Subject: RE: [Futurework] Coffee anyone? Lawry, I am always hopeful - no matter what. Attempts are being made constantly to open borders, not always with success and not always for the right reasons. But, they are moves toward association rather than separation. Equality isn't doing too well. One notes that everywhere some are more equal than others. My favorite operating rule is: "Do as you wish but harm no-one." I don't think such an operating rule has to change much over millennia. Harry ********************************* Henry George School of Los Angeles Box 655 Tujunga CA 91042 818 352-4141 ********************************* -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lawrence de Bivort Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2006 5:31 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [Futurework] Coffee anyone? Harry, It would seem that I am more hopeful about society and human beings than you are: indeed it seems to me that society does evolve. Working on improving the operating rule set is in my experience entirely feasible and, done well, successful. I will buttress my view that it is a society that refuses to periodically examine and improve its operating rules that, as you put it, 'devolves', with a quote from Thomas Jefferson: "I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and constitutions. But law and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind as that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him as a boy a civilized society to remain ever under the regime of their barbarous ancestors." Cheers, Lawry -----Original Message----- From: Harry Pollard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, April 14, 2006 7:33 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [email protected] Subject: RE: [Futurework] Coffee anyone? Lawry, Practically every concern I buy from will instantly take back without argument something that doesn't meet my approval. That's the "normal requirement". So normal that I expect it when I buy. When I lived in Canada, Eatons was noted for its instant return policy across the Dominion (is that word OK now?) We would hear that young ladies in remote parts of (say) Alberta would buy a prom dress - wear it - then return it to Eatons for a full refund. Maybe that policy was a reason why Eatons became so large and profitable. Henry George's 'Law of Human Progress' suggested that civilizations survived only when they enjoyed 'association in equality'. Insomuch as barriers were erected between people or justice (equality) was diminished, so would civilizations die. Perhaps societies don't so much evolve as devolve as their changed "operating rules" fail. Harry ********************************* Henry George School of Los Angeles Box 655 Tujunga CA 91042 818 352-4141 ********************************* -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lawrence de Bivort Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 3:54 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [Futurework] Coffee anyone? Harry, your notion of a 'normal requirement' is no longer adequate for our society. You have to look beyond the assumptions you grew up with and now so take for granted. Societies evolve; so must their 'operating rules.' Lawry -----Original Message----- From: Harry Pollard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 6:05 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Christoph Reuss'; [email protected] Subject: RE: [Futurework] Coffee anyone? Lawry, In a free society with a free market, if Whole Foods are producing fungus with their cakes, people will stop buying them and they'll go broke. However, it's a non-issue. We buy our cakes from Ruby's in Eagle Rock (about 12niles from us) and have done so for years. Made on the premises and delightful - haven't noticed any fungus. What on earth is this 'moral responsibility' that producers need rather than the normal requirement to provide what they say they are providing? Harry ********************************* Henry George School of Los Angeles Box 655 Tujunga CA 91042 818 352-4141 ********************************* -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lawrence de Bivort Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2006 10:22 AM To: 'Christoph Reuss'; [email protected] Subject: RE: [Futurework] Coffee anyone? Yes, this notion of Fair Trade is growing here in the US, too. There is a chain of stores, "Ten Thousand Villages" that sells crafts on this basis. And then there is Putumayo's CDs, too. Better quality crafts and music from these sources than the conventional commercial outlets. We had Fresh Fields/Whole Foods stores which seemed to have embraced some social consciousness, but then, if I remember correctly, they were bought up by a conventional chain and their quality has deteriorated (e.g. mold inside their layered cakes, because their cakes are made in New York, frozen and shipped to the Washington area, and sold in their store bakeries as if made fresh). Thinking back to Arthur's coffee VP, it may be that social consciousness has to be embedded in new types of organizations -- where the whole organization is designed with that kind of moral responsibility in mind, rather than hoping that heroic individuals within conventional organizations will be able to flourish. So perhaps part of a social consciousness initiative might focus on whole organizations that are designed and operate around such a principle. Cheers, Lawry -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Christoph Reuss Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2006 1:10 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [Futurework] Coffee anyone? Lawry asked: > I wonder if it might be possible to launch a corporate-responsibility > consciousness initiative. I do not mean legislation and regulated > protectionism, but a genuine moral initiative that included specific looks > at specific executive actions and policies, and recognized and morally > rewarded those who reflected that consciousness of responsibility? For coffee, sugar, chocolate, bananas etc. there already is one: The Fair Trade network ( http://www.fairtrade.net ), in N.America known as TransFair ( transfairusa.org , transfair.ca ). They pay much higher prices to the growers and guarantee good labor conditions and democratic participation rights in small-farmer coops. The high revenue for growers is often used for local educational and health projects, and the organic production methods avoid health hazards from pesticides to the growers. So it's up to the consumer to vote with their feet. In Switzerland, Fair Trade products (known here as "Max Havelaar" brand) have a high market share and can be found in regular store chains. Chris _______________________________________________ Futurework mailing list [email protected] http://fes.uwaterloo.ca/mailman/listinfo/futurework _______________________________________________ Futurework mailing list [email protected] http://fes.uwaterloo.ca/mailman/listinfo/futurework _______________________________________________ Futurework mailing list [email protected] http://fes.uwaterloo.ca/mailman/listinfo/futurework _______________________________________________ Futurework mailing list [email protected] http://fes.uwaterloo.ca/mailman/listinfo/futurework _______________________________________________ Futurework mailing list [email protected] http://fes.uwaterloo.ca/mailman/listinfo/futurework
