----- Original Message -----
From: Felix Stalder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2000 7:56 AM
Subject: <nettime> Gamblers in the casino capitalism


> [[From an email exchange between David Mandl, Dough Henwood, Ted Byfield,
> David Hudson and myself in preparation of the Tulipomania conference
> <http://www.balie.nl/tulipomania/>. Felix]]
>
>
> The following is an excerpt from Herb Greenberg's column on TheStreet.com
> yesterday. I've seen several letters like this on that site alone in the
> past few days. Not to make light of this poor guy's suffering, but I was
> wondering when we'd start seeing stories like this. I'm sure there are
> many more. Sad.
>
> -----------------------------------------
>
> Which brings us to some guy named Martin, who posted: "I'm writing with a
> heavy heart and tears in my eyes. I have worked hard all of my life,
> always trying to do the right thing for my family, friends and the world
> in general. I have never taken advantage of another person in any way. I
> have scrimped and saved over the years as I did not have the luxury of a
> company pension or retirement plan. When I became aware of CYBR and the
> EHC, I did voluminous amounts of research and only after I was totally
> convinced, I started buying. I admit that I probably got caught up in all
> of the good repartee being bantered about the boards and violated some of
> my own basic rules of investing, but I really believed and in fact, still
> do.
>
> "I have literally lost everything I have worked for my entire lifetime. A
> woman whose husband bought into CYBR on my recommendation called me this
> morning in tears as she thinks her husband is going to kill himself, as he
> did what I have done. We are both 62 years old and cannot recover from
> this. I called their son and told him to get over there. This is one of
> the most decent human beings you could ever hope to know. His life is
> ruined now. They are both sick and have less chance than I do of
> recovering from this. ...
>
> "I did make a giant mistake by buying on margin. I have had to liquidate
> shares several times for margin calls and thought that the nightmare was
> finally over. Then this week happened. I am now so far in the hole that
> even if I liquidate totally, I still owe! Now that's incredible and shows
> the dangers of margin. I have until tomorrow and I don't know what to do,
> other than hope for a miracle."
>
>
> ------][------
>
> >The following is an excerpt from Herb Greenberg's column on
> >TheStreet.com yesterday. I've seen several letters like this on that
> >site alone in the past few days. Not to make light of this poor guy's
> >suffering, but I was wondering when we'd start seeing stories like
> >this. I'm sure there are many more. Sad.
>
> It is sad, but you've got to wonder what people were thinking when they
> bought these turkeys. Well one thing they were thinking is: 30% annual
> returns! The Next Microsoft! Sure there were, are, and always will be a
> lot of carnival barkers hawking crappy stocks, but the buyers are often
> not wholly innocent, except maybe in retrospect.
>
> My friend Gregg Wirth, who used to cover stock scams for TheStreet.com,
> interviewed lots of people who fell for pump & dump schemes. He asked them
> why they bought the financial equivalent of vaporware. They repeatedly
> said, "Because the broker said they were going to triple!" Sorry to be so
> hard-hearted, but at least some people should know better.
>
>
> ------][------
>
>
> Totally agree, Doug, and I think most people on this list are aware of my
> "fuck 'em all" attitude to New Economy greedbags. I'd be lying if I said I
> wasn't looking forward to this Big Correction. And I agree that lots of
> people who were drooling over 300%-returns-at-any-cost will now try to
> rewrite history and portray themselves as wittle innocents.
>
> But, I don't know, I think there are SOME number of people who were
> basically trying to jump on the bandwagon and not be left behind, just
> thinking that hunting for the Big Hot Stock is what you need to do to make
> money nowadays (true, to a certain degree--a bank CD ain't gonna cut it
> anymore). The problem is figuring out who they were. Not easy.
>
> I'll tell you one thing: I have zero tolerance for people who sue their
> brokers, claiming that they hadn't been told about the risks. There've
> been a bunch of these, and I bet there'll be many more now. I'm sure most
> of these people are full of shit, and I have about as much sympathy for
> them as I have for the people who sue lumber yards for not warning them
> not to eat sawdust.
>
> ------][------
>
>
> >But, I don't know, I think there are SOME number of people who were
> >basically trying to jump on the bandwagon and not be left behind, just
> >thinking that hunting for the Big Hot Stock is what you need to do to
> >make money nowadays (true, to a certain degree--a bank CD ain't gonna
> >cut it anymore).
>
> Here's where I reveal my bleeding heart a bit and say, yes, I sympathize
> with *some* of these people. My father, in the US, for example, is
> convinced inflation will be back and that mere savings won't be able to
> keep up. Being 'left behind' wouldn't be just, you know, embarrassing --
> some are genuinely worried about going under while the economy roars off
> without them.
>
> More broadly, people are simply convinced -- in the same way that they're
> convinced that the streets are more and more dangerous every year or that
> there's no such thinng as a nuclear threat anymore -- that this is the new
> way of the world, that investing is "smart" and what could be smarter than
> investing in stocks that promise the greatest returns?
>
> Here in Germany, one out of five folks are playing the markets all of a
> sudden. Risk has never been so attractive to the Germans. One week, Die
> Woche is warning of the dangers of 'Gl�ckspiel B�rse' (the stock market
> gamble) on its cover, but the next, Stern puts a "How to Play the Markets"
> package on its cover.
>
> *Most* people are aware of the risks now that we've had our little
> 'corrections,' but before this spring, serious-looking guys in suits with
> serious-sounding degrees and titles were telling them that there were no
> signs on the horizon that this wouldn't go on indefinitely.
>
>
> ------][------
>
> The question is, what will be the fallout of these sob-stories?
>
> While I'm not sure if suing your broker is it hitting the right target,
> it's clear that there were significant interests in the hype, and that,
> like in any pyramid scheme, the ones who came late and with limited
> resources are the ones who get hurt the most. Keeping with the pyramid
> scheme metaphor, who were to ones who got in big and early? They must have
> known the bubble character of all of this, or are the markets really run
> by 23 years olds who cannot remember what they had for lunch yesterday?
>
>
> ------][------
>
>
> > 23 years olds who cannot remember what they had for lunch yesterday?
>
> as opposed to us 35-years-olds who can't remember what we had for lunch
> yesterday?
>
> but more to the point, i disagree. that's not to say i'm sym- pathetic to
> people who got burned: i'm no more sympathetic to them than they were to
> others who didn't pile on the money- grubbing rollercoaster. you can look
> at it as a matter of personal greed, but it was structural; that's why
> things like rent are going through the roof, hurting everyone.
>
> but since i sympathize with the people who never lost because --very
> likely--they didn't have the resources or knowhow to get involved, i might
> as well sympathize with the suckers who got burned. besides, that way i
> can save all my venom for the rats who won big by ripping off the unwashed
> masses whichever way the markets went.
>
> these freshly minted losers may prove to be a political force not to be
> trifled with. not because they understand what hap- pened, but because
> they'll be legion--and pissed.
>
>
> ------][------
>
>
> > Keeping with the pyramid
> > scheme metaphor, who were to ones who got in big and early? They must
have
> > known the bubble character of all of this, or are the markets really run
by
> > 23 years olds who cannot remember what they had for lunch yesterday?
>
> It's always been very clear who the winners were (by design):
>
> - The investment banks underwriting the IPOs: They made billions no
>   matter what, both in underwriting fees and on the shares they
>   received (dirt cheap), which they almost always flipped right after
>   IPO day for massive profits.  They were much too smart to play the
>   game at all.  Their money was guaranteed.
>
> - The principals of the startups: The companies were always brought
>   public at artificially low prices (at the companies' expense, if
>   that matters to you), guaranteeing the principals huge gains
>   immediately.  Many of them sold stock as soon as as they could or
>   used sophisticated hedging strategies to lock in their gains.  Those
>   who didn't have lost their money too.  (They're not as smart as the
>   bankers.)
>
> Other people might have made money here and there, but basically anyone
> who bought in on one of these hot IPOs (TheStreet.com, TheGlobe.com,
> iVillage.com, drkoop.com, etc., etc.) on IPO day lost it all.
>
> ------][------
>
>
> >It's always been very clear who the winners were (by design):
> >
> >- The investment banks underwriting the IPOs: They made billions no
> >  matter what, both in underwriting fees and on the shares they
> >  received (dirt cheap), which they almost always flipped right after
> >  IPO day for massive profits.  They were much too smart to play the
> >  game at all.  Their money was guaranteed.
>
> I'm an ignorant in these matters, but isn't there something like a
> hold-period in which people who get preferred stock (or whatever the
> technical terms is for those who can buy it before it goes public) cannot
> sell it, exactly to prevent this kind of speculative behaviour?
>
>
>
> ------][------
>
>
> Ah, yes and no: Yes for the principals of the company, but no for the
> brokerage firms. Think about it: When a company goes public, brokerage
> firms are allocated a bunch of shares FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE OF SELLING
> THEM. They're the ones who actually peddle the stock to the public. They
> MAY also keep some for themselves if they think it's a good investment.
> It'd be interesting to see what these firms thought these companies were
> REALLY worth, based on how much of their own money they risked on the
> stock.
>
> And getting back to the holding-period question: That's why fancy hedging
> strategies were invented for principals to use. These people couldn't
> legally sell the stock, but they could use option "collars" that locked in
> the gains for when they did eventually sell. There was a very good paper
> floating around the net last year with statistics on how popular these
> strategies were (i.e., how little confidence the principals had!). I work
> with equity derivatives quants who know the ins and outs of this stuff
> pretty well.
>
>
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