Hi Ray, you're talking past my points.
> Methinks you protest too much Chris. The world is such a bad place because people accept too much. > Everyone seems to think that by > making the other guy wrong that in someway that makes us right and it > isn't true. That's not what I was saying. > There is plenty in the public libraries and on the internet about > every group to show that right and wrong are not the provinces of > any one group. The question is how much (or how little) wrong there is with a "group", how much that group harassed or genocided other groups, and how that group handled its wrongs afterwards (e.g. compensation and apologies, or stubbornly continuing the wrongs instead). On both accounts, there are vast differences between you-know-which-two-countries. Of course there are no angels, but if we are interested in justice, we can't simply lump the worst offenders and the most decent "groups" together -- this only rewards the offenders and sends the wrong message to everyone. (What a coincidence that the US opposes the ICC.) > If you don't like American culture then get to work and build up > your own one at a time. That's what I do, but the multi-billion $ cultural imperialism gets in the way. Worse, it turns back the clock, destroying past achievements. > I talk to the people in the companies, that are charging outrageous > interest rates, about their Judeo-Christianity. You may have noticed that Switzerland charges significantly _lower_ interest rates than the US and EU. > So the way that we deal with barbarism is to resist it and I would suggest > that you simply get to work to do it at home and show your people and the > world, the best side of what you love and value. That's what I'm trying to do. > The Calvinist and other non-conformist groups who came were as much from > France, Western and Eastern Europe as from the British Empire. Your use of the term "groups" is deliberately blurring. There's a vast difference between - a few private individuals (or rather, outcasts) from a country coming to the US and - an Empire making a colony out of the US and systematically "re-ordering" the land and its native population for the benefit of that Empire. > Calvinism and the other non-conformist groups supplied their sense of > righteousness. "Righteousness" makes people insensitive and unable to > empathize. Yeah right, that's why the Red Cross was founded in Geneva, by a devoted Calvinist. > Self-righteousness does not make any of us attractive. Righteousness is to claim merits that one does not really have. That's not what I do. > The Swiss were no better to the Romany taking their children and refusing > ever to return them. Switzerland was certainly better to the Romany than the US to the Natives -- after all, there was no genocide, Reservations etc. involved, and it was _meant_ for the best of the children (unlike what the US did to the Natives). Concerning the topic of this thread, it was not cultural imperialism against another country, just an unfortunate treatment of migrating guests. Another big difference to the US treatment of Natives (or slaves) is that this short episode of Swiss history has been settled and compensated, BTW long before Ed Fagan sniffed money in the gold affair. You are trying to mislead the audience by mixing the two. > > > Americans don't like to fight wars, they like to do business. > > > > Both at the same time... (largest exporter of armaments and wars!) > > It is one thing to sell and another to do. The US does both in pole position. It fits together well because you can sell more armaments if you export wars too. > I meant it when I said that Americans are "Winner Take All types." If > anyone decides to mess with America proper they are not understanding that > America spent one million dollars for every Indian that it killed in the > 1880s. How much was the dollar then? They would do the same again. These > are not people to mess around with and if you believe Rumsfield or Bush > cares about what you are saying, then you aren't listening. I know them > firsthand. I cannot believe that the Arabs became stupid all of a sudden > on 9/11. But it looks like they did. Perhaps it wasn't Arabs after all, but other Mid-Easterners... http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=75266∓contrassID=2 > > Btw, Ray, why did you and your father serve in the US Army ? > > [...] Later he was in the Far East and served in the Hagganah with an > American Indian contingent in Israel. What an irony of history that Native victims of a landgrab helped another grabber to kill other Native victims of a landgrab. > > To "return a favor" to the people of Vietnam ? (um, which favor?) > > America lost in Vietnam. How generous of America to lose! You still didn't say what was the favor the US had to return. (Hint: My point was that the US requires no "favors to return"...) > I probably know more damaged people than you know Vietnamese from that > undeclared "war." In spite of your egocentric accounting, there are many more Vietnamese victims than US victims of that war. (Even if we count only those still alive, and ignore the ~2 million killed civilians...) Do you want to portray the US as a victim of Vietnam or what? > As for Vietnam? They seem fine now Actually, Agent Orange still "produces" birth defects today, and the US refuses to clean up the toxic mess they left behind. The German word "Vergangenheitsbewältigung" doesn't exist in the English language -- perhaps because the concept doesn't exist either. > but we have to tell the truth and accept that the world is not filled > with Righteousness and that those who claim it will always find the evil > within themselves too late for their own lives. I believe now that the > only enemy is chauvinism, provinciality and a lack of respect for what > each group has been doing Ray, before you talk of truth, please get your facts right. And before you accuse me of righteousness, clean up your own house. And before you talk of lack of respect, please start repecting those who deserve it, instead of injustly smearing them. Regards, Chris > It is late and thanks for the challenge. I revisited some places that > needed so.
