Harry Pollard wrote: > > Brad, > > You're still mad! Whether at me, or at yourself, I don't know. Maybe, you > don't know. > > You told me rather more about Socrates than I really wanted to know. I > talked only of the method of teaching called "Socratic Questioning". A > method which teaches students to look inside themselves for understanding.
As I wrote, I was writing about Socrates, not about you. And, yes, you got more about S. than you asked for. But then I take email to be a relatively free-form medium.... > > This, as opposed to having stuff ladled into the open ears, to be > regurgitated at week's end (probably to be forgotten the following week). A > good teacher can make the syllabus come alive. Unfortunately, the new > standards seem to making the teacher little more than a middle-man. There are many ways to teach, and Socratic (smug know-it-all pretending to know nothing -- damned tanuki...) and info-ladler do not exhaust the option space. You may indeed teach in a way different from both the tanuki and the schoolmarm. If you do, that's great. We can never have enough good teachers. One other reference I would make is to Lawrence Kohlberg's notion of "the hidden curriculum": what the school teaches by the form of life students (and teachers, and janitors, and principals, et al.) experience in it, as opposed to what the words mouthed in the classes are. For instance, I studied "philosophy" in college, but what I was doing was not philosophical, but rather doing assignments to get tested and graded. The medium, as Marshall McLuhan said, is the [co-]message. And you are right: I keep beating on these subjects because I was hurt so badly. If I had had an education like perhaps Montaigne had, I might not waste energy trying to exorcise these demons which I would find misfortunate to persons but alien to me. > > If you were doing one of my courses and didn't want to do it, you could opt > out and do other work. As you might expect, I try to make students as free > as possible in a compulsory system. However, my courses are so much fun, > they are quickly seduced back into the program. I have no idea how it would go. But if you are a good teacher, I might well disagree with some or all of your ideas but still find the classes both worth my time and energy to participate in them, and also, as you say, enjoyable. We don't have to agree [about first-order theories...] to have fun together [fun being a second-order social construction in which the theories find their place as "content"...]. > > You say "Nobody can see another in the darkness." > > Perhaps not - but you can be aware of another. No argument. But I think life is confusing enough without our saying things in ways that easily get misunderstood -- or am I the only person who misunderstood what you mean by "man's desires are infinite" (excuse if I misquoted here...) etc.? It is a shame we cannot meet "for real". It might fairly quickly clear up a lot of things (or it might not) and it might change a lot of things (or it might not) or maybe something else (or maybe not).... \brad mccormick > > Harry > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Brad wrote: > > >Harry Pollard wrote: > > > > > > Brad, > >[snip] > > > I take full blame for not using the 2" x 4" before now. All my teaching is > > > Socratic. You'll recall that Socrates told the student nothing. By clever > > > questions, he would draw out from the student what the student already knew > > > - but didn't know he knew. > >[snip] > > > >I know nothing about your teaching. Everything that > >follows is about Socrates and persons like him. If the > >shoe does not fit, *please* do not think I am trying > >to force you or anyone else to wear it! > > > >-- > > > > From what I have read of Socrates, I think he was > >a thoroughly loathsome creature. A mean-spirited > >hypocrite except when guzzling the booze of the > >people he conned into admiring him. In Japan > >there is a saying that you need to beware that > >under a monk's robes a trickster may be hiding: > >a tanuki (an animal reputed to have > >magic powers). Socrates was a tanuki, jolly > >(repulsive?) pot-belly > >and all. > > > >Socrates pretended to not know anything in order to > >trip people up. Instead, he could have explained, > >gently and clearly to them, what apparently he did > >know although he did not practice it, and that > >is the theory of dialogical communication [see > >Jurgen Habermas and Karl-Otto Appel, and others for what I > >am tallking about here], and > >how, in order to have a dialog, both speaker and > >listener have to want to participate, that > >neither should try to coerce (or deceive!) the other, etc. > > > >I would say of Socrates as I have also said of > >Kant's Categorical Imperative, that when an > >argument demonstrates a person is wrong [logically], > >but the person still wants to say "Yes, but", then > >the life situation in which the argument has been > >pursued needs to be analyzed to find out what > >the real problem, which the inquiry into the stated problem is > >obscuring, is. > > > >I'd be glad to talk more about my take on > >Socrates. E.g., about his heroic death > >for principle instead wussing out and going > >into exile. The man was 78 years old! He had > >already had a long life, so why not make sure to > >exit in such a way as to maximize his chances > >of gaining a place in history, instead of > >dying in his bed some day in the not too > >distant future and nobody noticing? Socrates > >was a great self-promoter. > > > >Socratic teaching is like Zen koans. The "solution" > >is simply to walk away and leave the "master" to figure > >out where to get his next meal for himself or > >let him simply rot in situ if that's what he > >wants to do. > > > > If you meet the Buddha [Socrates, Jesus, > > Mother Theresa...] in the road, greet > > him politely as you would any other stranger, > > and proceed from there according to how he > > responds. If he treats you with sincere > > and straightforward respect, > > then do the same in return. > > But if he tries to con you into wanting him > > to jerk you around, "Just say no." and > > keep on truckin down the road. There's > > little cause for concern that the next > > person he meets will fail to fall in his > > trap and give him a free meal (and maybe > > much more!). > > > >If you are a Socratic teacher, I hope I can say > >with some confidence that, > >had I encountered you in my last > >few years of schooling (when I was finally > >learning what schooling is all about), I would have politely > >said: "No, thank you.", for I would thereby > >have proven I knew the most important thing you could > >teach me: to not get suckered in by mind > >f-ckers. I keep practicing this skill every day, > >because I know my childrearing hurt my soul > >and left me vulnerable to semiotic infection. > > > > Nobody can see another in the darkness. > > > >\brad mccormick > > > >-- > > Let your light so shine before men, > > that they may see your good works.... (Matt 5:16) > > > > Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. (1 Thes 5:21) > > > ><![%THINK;[SGML+APL]]> Brad McCormick, Ed.D. / [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >----------------------------------------------------------------- > > Visit my website ==> http://www.users.cloud9.net/~bradmcc/ > > ****************************** > Harry Pollard > Henry George School of LA > Box 655 > Tujunga CA 91042 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Tel: (818) 352-4141 > Fax: (818) 353-2242 > ******************************* -- Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works.... (Matt 5:16) Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. (1 Thes 5:21) <![%THINK;[SGML+APL]]> Brad McCormick, Ed.D. / [EMAIL PROTECTED] ----------------------------------------------------------------- Visit my website ==> http://www.users.cloud9.net/~bradmcc/
