On Aug 28, 2008, at 2:19 PM, Dan wrote:
>
> At 8:26 AM -0700 8/28/2008, Bruce Johnson wrote:
>> WOW. Pystar must have hired SCO's legal team. That's 'epic fail'
>> territory.
>
> I donno. I think it has a shot.
>
> *Someone* *somewhere* needs to challenge the crap companies load in
> these EULAs... This whole "it's legal until it's not" BS is stifling
> us. Maybe they won't win this time. But maybe, just maybe, they'll
> set the ground work for a win next time.
Yes, but applying completely inappropriate sections of the law will
not do it.
Apple is free to put any damn thing in their EULA that they want, if
you accept it, that's the contract.
If you don't like it, don't buy or use OS X.
Pystar's business is equivalent to a company buying Hyundais, slapping
a big Mercedes hood ornament on it, selling them as Mercedes, then
crying 'restraint of trade' when Mercedes sues their butts.
(See! I worked the mercedes ref in there, that outta keep Wallace
happy...)
>
>
> There is a legal question here as to the separation of hardware and
> software.
No there really isn't.
The legal question YOU'RE talking about regarding Apple's EULA is the
old one about whether you're buying or licensing software, and despite
what Pystar is claiming, is not the issue at hand.
If Apple was saying that you couldn't install someone ELSE'S software
on them, THEN we're into restraint-of-trade issues.
If Apple was suing an end customer, that WOULD bring up the EULA
question (Notice the two words at the very beginning of the acronym,
EU...End User. Pystar is NOT the End User...they can't argue in court
ANYTHING about the EULA...BECAUSE IT DOES NOT APPLY TO THEM.)
Pystar is acting as a distributor of Apple clones without a license to
do so, and THAT is a entirely different kettle of fish, legally.
Their antitrust claims and countersuit are just so much legal
smokescreen designed to keep their case alive long enough for their
lawyers to bleed the company dry, and the people running it to make
off with what assets remain.
The more products they sell in the glare of publicity the better...for
them. Not so good for the customers.
> If the courts rule that they're separate products,,, the
> whole industry will change -- for the better, IMO.
>
Oh really? based on what? The wishful concept that all of a sudden
Apple will sell a gazillion copies of their software? How?
I've said until I was blue in the face: Apple is a hardware company.
Their competition is not Microsoft. Their competition is Dell, HP and
Acer. If they start selling OS X on computers, that MS vise on their
balls starts tightening.
All MS has to do is announce an increase in in Windows licensing
prices; they're perfectly free to start leaning on companies to not
offer OS X, especially as Apple licensing OS X would take ALL that
monopoly and antitrust crap RIGHT off the table, and like it or not
the corporate world is deeply invested in MS.
"Selling OS X for other computers" is akin to telling Ford to stop
making cars, and instead make engines for GM.
> What's the alternative - do nothing, while we bask in the
> marginalization of Macs?
>
Apple is NOT "doing nothing". In fact Apple is doing pretty damned
well following their current business path. What you're really
complaining about is that Apple isn't doing what YOU want.
If Macs are 'too marginalized' for you, you're perfectly free to
install any other OS that'll run on your system.
Moreover you're fee to install any OS you can legally install on any
OTHER hardware. Hell Apple probably doesn't care all that much if you
buy a copy of OS X and install it on some random piece of hardware.
They DO care if you go into business selling their OS installed on
other company's hardware to other people without Apple's permission.
If you went to Ford and started buying cars (or ford engines,
installed them in Hyundais) then set yourself up as a Ford dealer
(unauthorized) they'll sue your ass so fast the head up it will spin.
Apple has a right to determine WHO resells THEIR software
commercially, which is what Pystar is doing.
> I'm sorry. It's time for OS X to go mainstream.
No it isn't.
"It's time for OS X to run on cheap-ass hardware so I don't have to
spend as much money, waaah!"
You want to make this happen? All of you "Sell OS X on any computer"
folks have to do is to buy enough stock in Apple to force the Board to
do that.
Just bitching that you want cheaper/midrange/blah blah Macs isn't
going to do it...Apple's pretty much selling Macs as fast as they can
make them.
You'll note that Dell's business model ('sell cheap-ass computers
copying other peoples innovations') isn't working nearly as well.
<http://tinyurl.com/5gaezf
>
> And if that means
> Apple has to have its a** kicked, so be it. Apple can lead the
> charge or deal with the hoof prints on its back, as we stampede into
> the future.
Yep, dammit, tell that friggin' goose to lay faster or we'll just cut
it open and take 'em all at once!
I'm kinda of wondering where y'all think you'll be once Apple has all
those 'hoofprints on it's back', since Apple still owns OS X. If you
think Linux, dude, you've never used Linux.
Fundamentally, the main bitch here is that Apple, by not giving OS X
away (which, face it, they'll end up being forced to do. Estimates
are that up to 70%-90% of all the copies of Windows in the world are
pirated.) is going to never dominate the computer world.
What if that's NOT their goal?
Why SHOULD it be the goal? Why does it HAVE to be One OS To Rule Them
All?
Competition is good. three OS'es with significant market share are
going to drive innovation...remember the good old days of Illustrator
vs FreeHand? Anyone notice the stagnation at Adobe now that they DON'T
have a rival?
Since y'all think that Apple's hardware is foo, you want to cut
Apple's profits and (their concomitant R&D dollars) don't forget
Apple's main source of income is still their computer line....the one
you all think is so damned expensive because Dell can lose money
selling crap-ass $499 boxes of random assorted parts. Look at Dell's
Optiplex line, which is their business-class line. Same prices as
Apple, and you get to know what was put into your computer.
No shit, look up the serial number of a Dell Dimension sometime. In
the list of components, I've seen as many as 10 or 15 video chipsets.
Kinda sucks when you're trying to fix a video driver problem.
No Apple is doing JUST FINE the way they are; just because they're not
doing what YOU want does not mean they're failing.
--
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group
Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs
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