Hi, also, I'm not too sure where the idea that Microsoft has not been helping accessibility in more modern versions of windows. In fact, Windows 7, and more especially windows 8, are far more accessible than XP ever was. And their knew protocols, and APIs, that provide better accessibility now, then before. So again, not sure where this one came from. And I agree,, having an old machine with the older OS, is often the better option. Obviously, if you're fine with what you have now, then stay with it. However, XP will be losing support as of this time next year. So I would suggest, that you start looking at moving ahead now, before you're forced to. Mainly, because of the security risk you will be dealing with, when XP no longer is being provided the security updates. And in this modern world, where you are connected so much, to the Internet, it would be pointless to remain in a less secure OS. I myself, am seriously considering going with a Mac for my next computer, and dual booting windows on it. Best of both worlds. The only problem with that, is the cost of a Mac out right. Anyway, on with the games. LOL. Regards: Dallas
On 30/04/2013, at 22:39, Draconis <i...@dracoent.com> wrote: > Hi Dark, > > My responses are throughout. > > *snip* >> 1: compatibility with dos applications. >> >> As a huge fan of text rpgs, I play not a few games with dos such as >> fallthru, and age of legends, yet thanks to microsoft that would not be >> possible on a 64 bit machine. For sighted users this isn't a problem since >> they can use the dosbox emulator, and indeed newer dos, or dos style >> applications are still being developed using it, noteably Eamon deluxe (and >> since there are over 270 Eamon games that is quite a lot just on it's own). >> If a developer created a screen reader friendly version of dosbox or a >> similar way to run 16 bit console window applications, it would mean that >> older games, which have been playable for the past 30 years would continue >> to be so for the blind community. This is something I know the developer of >> Eamon deluxe has been looking into and discussing with the dosbox dev team, >> but perhaps some assistance from a programmer with more knolidge of screen >> readers' interaction with windows would be of help, that is unless someone >> cannot create say a small application that outputs dos text to sapi or >> similar. >> *snip* > >> First, there is a certain amount of irony that the first point on your list >> is essentially that you want to be able to cling to the past in order to >> move into the future. It is sort of like saying, thirty years ago, that you >> wouldn't use a CD player because it couldn't play your vinyl records. I use >> this analogy as someone who has a fair number of rare vinyl records which do >> not exist in modern formats. This doesn't keep me from having a CD player, >> or, these days, using iTunes. The vast, vast, vast majority of Windows users >> never upgrade their existing machine. They go buy a cheap new computer which >> happens to have the latest OS on it. When this occurs, rather than going >> through channels to keep using obsolete software, hang on to the old machine >> to play such games, and keep that machine in as good repair as possible, >> much as I have had to do with vinyl record players over the years. > > I still have my working Apple 2GS computer as well, specifically for the > nostalgia playing the old games I had for it. I've had it for, likely, longer > than many of the participants of this list have been alive, and it still > works, because I've taken care of it. > > So, while your option of an accessible DOS emulator would be the ideal, it is > something that is relatively easily worked around. > > *snip* >> 2: audio games created using vb6 and direct x. >> >> Microsoft have, as we've been told dropped vb6 support and messed about with >> many of their direct x components. with the number of accessible games being >> so small, it is a real shame when they cannot be run on newer machines due >> to lack of support for the components. >> >> Again, since windows xp existed as a viable os for close to 10 years and is >> still largely in use today, we're talking about a long period of time and >> not a few games, indeed a post last year on audiogames.net was from a 64 bit >> windows user who complained that the upgrade actually lost! them more than >> it gained. If I could be certain the dependencies to run games like classic >> pipe were still available in some sense for post xp windows, I'd be less >> concerned about upgrading my os. >> >> While I know vb6 is likely to continue as a viable option provided >> dependencies are installed, which is why developers like Jim and Aprone can >> still write games in it, I'm less certain regarding other components, >> especially with what I've heard of other games not working under later >> windows versions. >> *snip* > > This point is really just the same as your first point, with the same > solutions available, be that virtual machines, emulation, or hanging on and > maintaining an older machine for the time being. > > And, as far as Draconis goes, we are working to move our games forward to > modern operating systems. > > *snip* >> 3: interface. >> >> There is no denying that microsoft have by their nature created an interface >> which is more graphical, less logical and less customizable, a trend >> continued in windows 8. It is not for instance possible to have listed >> menues or coherent folder structures, not to mention the los of simpler, but >> more user friendly things like outlook express (a program I'd really! miss). >> This is frankly a pain in the arse, but is something I, ---- and likely >> others would be willing to suffer if it were for an over all bennifit, >> however that bennifit has not materialized. >> *snip* > > While I disagree that "more graphical" inherently means "less accessible"…I > think that age-old myth has been dispelled for years…there's no denying that > Microsoft has made a mess of things for everyone, not just visually impaired > users. This is why I am a Mac user. It is less frustration, less expensive, > and a far more productive and pleasant computing experience than what > Microsoft currently offers. And, with the ability to install and boot into > Windows as well, you do not need to lose access to your games. > > *snip* >> In general, for myself at least, the things I use a computer for would be >> far more harmed than bennifited from upgrading, since I'd have less access >> to software and games, a harder to use interface, and nothing I've seen >> related to the other things I use a computer for, ---- music, dvds, writing, >> using e mail that would particularly be of help, even in terms of net >> brousing, this business of mp3 playback is the first thing I've heard of >> that ie9 does which would actually be of help to me. >> *snip* > > At some point, you will be forced to upgrade. You can do it on your own terms > and find solutions to these challenges yourself, or you can wait until > circumstance makes it necessary, and have squandered the time you had to make > the upgrade smoother. I suppose it comes down to where the tipping point for > each individual will be. When does the future hold more promise than > retreading the ground of the past. > > *snip* >> While I know there are those who appreciate having the latest os because! it >> is the latest, for many people including myself computers have only >> instrumental value, ie, they are only valuable for what they do. Given this >> fact, and given the fact that microsoft have not particularly helped access >> in later versions of windows anyway, it is perfectly logical why people >> stick with more useable systems and with those that allow more access to >> games and software. >> *snip* > > I agree that upgrading just to be able to say you have the latest and > greatest is not a sound mindset. An upgrade should offer tangible benefits. > If it doesn't, you're clearly using the wrong OS for you, and perhaps should > consider alternatives. > >> *snip* >> While the former is not something that has an easy answer, the latter is >> something which people could! do something about, since the less painless a >> transition and the more freedom a person has to access what they can >> already, the more likely they will be to try something new since the less >> harm it will do them ultimately, and it would be nice if developers and >> other knolidgeable persons could help this transition. >> *snip* > > Again, though, this is back to the idea of wanting everything right now, or > nothing at all. Should people have not used CD's until every record ever made > was available? Should we not use ebooks because there are still some books we > can't get that way? Hanging on to a retired machine solves every point you > have raised here. > > Personally, for me, the best solution, were I in your shoes, would be to look > at a Mac if you are that concerned with the user experience, and keep XP > installed on a second partition for playing your old games. Mac will allow > you to stay current with a modern operating system, XP will allow you to > enjoy your old titles, and the entire setup in this case is fully accessible. > > The above points you raise are less reasons than justifications, in my > opinion. There are solutions, some of them reasonably simple, to both of them. > > Thanks for the thoughtful post. Hopefully, I've given you something to think > about as well. > --- > Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, > please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. 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