Almost any complex device using electricity can have or develop faults
that produce sparks or high local temperature capable of igniting
gasoline vapors in air. Some designs and manufacturing processes will
make this very unlikely, others less so.
Demonstrations make good PR but don't prove the impossibility or
establish the chances of things happening for other equipment or conditions.
If you want to have high confidence that it won't happen offer a well
advertised $1000 prize for anyone who can show how to make it happen.
However two thing make such events unlikely even for bad designs
1. In most such failures the device would fail before it happening at a
gas pump.
2. Most failures would be adequately isolated from the gasses by the case.
Recent physical damage could, however, make both these untrue.
If doors are opened then one must also consider conditions of chargers,
the connections, and phone being charging which are more likely to be
sources of ignition.
Cheers,
craig
On 3/19/2012 2:58 AM, Ronald Hongsermeier wrote:
Dear Henri,
Please carefully read the articles at snopes.com
What you are talking about is an urban legend. If someone cannot under
experimental conditions where they are actually trying to ignite
gasoline with a cell phone succeed in this attempt, why does the error
persist that you can do it by mistake?
http://www.snopes.com/autos/hazards/gasvapor.asp
http://www.snopes.com/autos/hazards/static.asp
Also, excuse me, but what motivation does a fuel multi have by
supposedly covering something like this up? If it was simply true, it
wouldn't harm either their business nor their profit margin. (The
person using the phone is the responsible one) Same thing with the
mobile phone companies. And with most service providers providing
flat-rates, they aren't even motivated to get more people to call by
having everybody talking on their phone whilst filling 'er up. Oh, I
get it, phone users don't want to be inhibited in their use of the
cell phone while tanking. So they're covering up the danger. Now I get
it. Not.
Let's talk about producers and related issues here, this myth has been
floating around, unsupported by facts, since 1999.
regards,
Ronald von Almostninedollardieselland
On 19.03.2012 06:19, Henri Naths wrote:
Hi Mark , Tom and all
Your right Mark 150 deaths that may or may not be caused cell phones
is not a problem for the oil companies. If you look at the billions
of gallons of gasoline sold in that time period and take a wild guess
at the stats it could be in the neighborhood of .0000001% . Not a
problem. But if it's you or your wife and kids in that small
insignificant % than its a huge problem. Just saying.
Henri
Any statisticians want weigh in ?
Sent from my iPhone
On 2012-03-18, at 9:43 PM, "Mark Ludlow"<[email protected]> wrote:
Dear Tom,
Most times it's relatively difficult just to keep the optimized gas/air
mixture igniting in the combustion chambers of our automobiles!
This, with
fat, healthy sparks!
If this were really an issue for the petroleum companies (It's not!)
they
would not be such rabid advocates of self-service gas!
Best, Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Thomas Reed [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 7:34 PM
To: [email protected]; Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification
Subject: Re: [Gasification] Fwd: For Your Safety from Shell Oil
Company -
THIS IS NOT A JOKE! Clash of technologies.
Dear Mark
I only passed on the warning from Shell Oil. I have had no experience
myself with cell phones igniting a combustible vapor, but I don't
think it
is impossible. What is your basis for thinking so?
Tom Reed
Thomas B Reed
On Mar 18, 2012, at 10:30 AM, "Mark Ludlow"<[email protected]> wrote:
No one has managed to make a cell phone ignite gasoline vapors. this
is Internet Urban Myth BS!
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of
Robert Kana
Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 6:57 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Gasification] Fwd: For Your Safety from Shell Oil
Company - THIS IS NOT A JOKE! Clash of technologies.
Dear Dr. Reed,
Thanks for the advice, we all know cell phones generate some kind of
magnetic power, when it is connecting. I believe there is a
connection, but gasoline fumes will not ignite unless there is a
source of
heat or spark.
Most of the US is now covered with Stage 2 vapor recovery system,
which consist of double pipes, one for fuel going in to the tank
another one fumes going back to storage tanks. All the gasoline trucks
are grounded with special wires at the fueling terminals, as well as
grounded in the gas station delivery points with the metal piping
connectors.
Over 30 years of gas station operator, contractor and installing
underground storage tanks in NY, I had 2 experiences with fires.
Actually one fire and one explosion. They both involved with the
fumes.
First incident in one of my gas stations, there was a spill in hot
summer, over fill gasoline spilled on the floor. The next car come to
get gas, stopped right on the spill and it caught a fire from the hot
muffler. We put out the fire immediately, but instructed all the gas
stations to keep a bucket full of water to wash any spill and cool the
vapors of gasoline. On second incident, one of my mechanic friend was
fixing a gas tank and he wanted to look inside the tank with a hand
lamp. The heat source from the lamp cause explosion of the fumes in
the tanks, my friend survived the accident.
I just want to add couple more pre cautions. Most of us fill the gas
at self service.
When the nozzle clicks, come to closest number and do not overfill.
If there is a spill no matter how small just put on some water, most
of the gas stations has water for cleaning windshields.
When you pull in the gas station, make sure the ground is clean.
And always remember, the fumes from the gasoline is extremely
flammable.
Regards,
Robert
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