After the first free year, an AWS medium instance with linux can be rented for less than $500/yr. That is plenty enough to serve up J hwlp pahes, as eell as run a locked-down J exe that only runs an example J session to let newbies try online experiments from the J software site.
Skip On Jun 27, 2014 7:29 PM, "Ian Clark" <[email protected]> wrote: > Spot-on, Bob. > > Oh, yes. We could have done so so much more (and so so differently) with a > running J process integrated with jwiki -- and not only to offer the user a > working J to try things out. For example (just one of many possible > opportunities) it could have handled most of the heavy work of hyperlinking > -- which has been a labor-intensive and error-prone process. Another > example: we could have ditched the collection of Ancillary Pages in favor > of a new crop of interactive tutorials -- a 21-century follow-on of the > highly successful j602 "Labs". And all those little embedded code samples > would have taken on a distinctly different form. > > And -- yes -- I have J verbs to launch the NuVoc page for a given > primitive. Though not to recognise its valence (yet). Easy to write as a > patch for locale 'jijs' in j602. And no doubt for JHS and JQT too, but I > haven't got into the guts of those yet. > > In this day-and-age, there's no enduring technical reason for the UI of a > product and the UI of its Help system to be deployed as two distinct > interfaces. Only (a) tradition, and (b) the fact they're designed and > implemented by two distinct bunches of people. Study Ableton Live ( > www.ableton.com) for a product with a rich functionality that's seamlessly > integrated with its on-line help. Or if you want to compare it with another > programmer IDE (after all, writing J verbs is not really like writing > music), how about Apple's Xcode? > > Recall too that even in the 1990s Mathematica was delivering ALL of its > on-line help in the form of "notebooks" (*.NB) -- the prime medium of user > output with that product. The moral equivalent in J would be to deliver the > entire content of jwiki, including NuVoc, in the form of IJS scripts (...or > IJT's??*!) with no diminution of users' experience. > > Something along these lines is technically achievable with JHS -- but > Javascript isn't a serious arrow in my quiver (and I don't see why it > should have to be). Frankly I'd like to see J itself as an alternative > scripting language in place of Javascript (it needs its own J-like DOM > interface -- as a new crop of Foreigns maybe?) -- though the security > implications of wide deployment of J in that role are worrying, when you > think of how Java and Flash are having to patch a never-ending stream of > security exposures. > > But at least NuVoc as it stands can be used in conjunction with a 40 year > old design of UI, like jconsole, which is still popular among important > classes of J users (i.e. those of us over 70). There's always this need for > bringing up the trailing edge of technological innovation. Which is what I > see NuVoc as doing, if you want to be brutally clear-eyed about it. > > > On Fri, Jun 27, 2014 at 4:26 AM, robert therriault <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > Congratulations to both Ian and Henry for great work on Nuvoc. > > > > One of the things that I found particularly illuminating was the J test > > for a number of reasons: > > > > 0) Not a surprise, but under the rules of not being able to use a running > > session I did spectacularly badly on the test. I won't give my score but > it > > probably rhymes with hero. > > 1) This made me think about how I investigate J and the fact that the > > interactive session is key to my experience. This is true of labs, trying > > out phrases or solving problems. > > > > This made me think of a few extra possibilities: > > > > 0) How powerful would Nuvoc become if it were provided in a window next > to > > a running J session? I know this can be done in JHS. > > 1) Further, if a double click on a primitive in the interactive session > > took you to the corresponding Nuvoc page in the second window? Probably > > some javascript dazzle to do that. > > > > Nice work both of you. > > > > Cheers, bob > > > > On Jun 26, 2014, at 7:14 AM, Henry Rich <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > The new NuVoc is twice revised from the previous version: first I added > > technical details, then Ian rewrote it all to achieve that > 'straightforward > > style', aimed at the programmer who is trying to get a job done. It's > easy > > reading, achieved by careful writing: simple presentation of concepts > with > > examples, using typography as a framework for the flow of ideas. You > also > > need formatting conventions that don't perplex a novice, a page design > that > > both lets the beginner understand a primitive at a glance and gives the > > expert full detail, and enough hyperlinks and supporting material to > bring > > a newcomer along. > > > > > > It was an eye-opening apprenticeship for me to see him do it. Writing > > this kind of material is very different from writing a book. > > > > > > Henry Rich > > > > > > On 6/26/2014 8:41 AM, Simon Barker wrote: > > >> I also would like to say a big thank you for what is turning out to > be a > > >> work of great depth and richness. Really enjoying reading it, the > > >> presentation and straightforward style are just encouraging me to keep > > >> reading. A true page turner! > > >> > > >> Kind regards, > > >> > > >> Simon > > >> . > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: [email protected] > > >> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ian Clark > > >> Sent: 26 June 2014 12:11 > > >> To: General forum > > >> Subject: Re: [Jgeneral] Announcing NuVoc, Version Two > > >> > > >> Thanks, John. > > >> > > >> > > >> On Wed, Jun 25, 2014 at 4:02 PM, John Baker <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > >> > > >>> Ian, > > >>> > > >>> I have been following NuVoc revisions for sometime. Let me be the > > >>> first to express my thanks for everyone that has worked on NuVoc. > This > > >>> is is an excellent explication and recasting of the J dictionary. > > >>> Eveyone at all levels of J expertise will find something of value in > > >>> NuVoc. Just this morning it reminded me of _: and p.. facilities I > > >>> sort off knew were there J but I have not used lately. > > >>> > > >>> Well done everyone! > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> On Wed, Jun 25, 2014 at 8:24 AM, Ian Clark <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > >>> > > >>>> This post is a formal announcement of NuVoc, Version 2. > > >>>> > > >>>> For the details, go to > > >>>> http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Vocabulary/AboutNuVoc > > >>>> > > >>>> This saves rambling on about what is quite adequately covered there. > > >>>> But one thing deserves to be repeated... > > >>>> > > >>>> Thanks are due to Ric Sherlock, who designed the NuVoc portal and > > >>>> drafted trial layouts for the primitives-pages, to others who > > >>>> contributed pages > > >>> and > > >>>> pioneered presentational ideas, notably Devon McCormick, David > > >>>> Lambert, > > >>> Bob > > >>>> Therriault and Dan Bron, plus several others who commented on > > >>>> material > > >>> and > > >>>> offered encouragement. (Apologies to any significant contributors > > >>>> whose names have been omitted.) > > >>>> > > >>>> But most of all, my heartfelt thanks to Henry Rich, at whose > > >>>> instigation this major revision was undertaken, and whose monumental > > >>>> and meticulous labors over the past half-year to make it happen have > > >>>> been truly > > >>> Herculean! > > >>>> But, as I'm sure you'll agree, by no means Sisyphean :-) > > >>>> > > >>>> Ian Clark > > >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>> -- For information about J forums see > > >>>> http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > >>>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> -- > > >>> John D. Baker > > >>> [email protected] > > >>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>> For information about J forums see > http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > >>> > > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> For information about J forums see > http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > >> > > >> > > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> For information about J forums see > http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > >> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
