On Sat, 2020-03-07 at 20:21 +0100, Ulrich Mueller wrote:
> > > > > > On Sat, 07 Mar 2020, Matt Turner wrote:
> > > > The list is almost exclusively about dev-python/, i.e. packages that
> > > > do not install end-user applications but Python modules.
> > > 
> > > Like www-apps/nikola, for example?
> > This is not a productive way to communicate.
> 
> The point is that packages that are perfectly working, actively
> maintained upstream (and the ebuild version bumped in the last month)
> are being last-rited all of a sudden.
> 
> What message does that send to users about the suitability of Gentoo
> for usage in a production environment?

What message does send the fact that Gentoo is defaulting to
an unmaintained (upstream) version of Python and for years have problems
moving forward?  Switching to 3.6 was a massacre already, and users felt
it.

Surely, some people will claim that I'm removing 'perfectly working,
blah blah blah' packages.  Completely ignoring the fact that the mask
explicitly asks *which* packages are worth keeping.  But some people
will simply realize that I'm trying to make Python in Gentoo sustainable
again.

It's easy to complain.  It's hard to come up with good solutions.

The current rough count for packages missing 3.7 support is 1057.  How
many of them are *you* willing to port?  Is it a crime that we're trying
to remove ~200 packages from that list?

Surely, you can claim we could just drop them to maintainer-needed. 
What problem does that solve?  The package would still miss 3.7 support.
Users will still suffer when we switch the default (if they have any
users, that is).  We would still have to last rite them when 3.6 is
gone.  What's the gain?

Right, let's talk about m-needed.  Over 2000 packages already and still
growing.  What message does *that* send to the users?

How about the following message: the difference between Gentoo
and Debian stable is that Gentoo doesn't have the 'b'.

Finally, what message does it send to our users when developers keep
picking up fights like this?  You seem to disagree with my work
on Gentoo, and the only solution you can come up is publicly shaming me?
This isn't 'let's discuss a better solution' kind of mail, this is
'justify yourself before me, you puny developer, how dare you do things
I don't like'.

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny

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