I'm new to this list and to Gentoo. I'm curious if/when Gentoo might
have a "release" type portage branch that only gets security updates and
severe bug fixes. I noticed that on the list of goals for this server
project, so I'm hoping this is the right place to post this. Here is
the background that builds up to this question and sort of my hope for
Gentoo.
I've tried many different distros. I am planning to run a small website
on my server with apache, tomcat, php, postgresql and bugzilla, so to me
it is like a "production" machine, but this clearly isn't a large
corporate type environment, and I'm trying to choose the right distro
for this. But this really isn't a "which distro is best" question.
I run linux on my laptop for my own personal projects and to learn. I
had debian for a short while, but as it typically goes, I was unhappy
with the old-ness of the applications and never felt right about running
something called "testing" or "unstable". I tried Fedora for a day or
two but it just didn't seem right and I hated yum. I have used
slackware quite a bit. I had avoided slackware for a long time because
of it's lack of "real" package management, but once I started using it,
I was thinking "wow, why isn't this more popular, it's great!". I
started to dislike automatic package managers and dependency checking in
other distros. Too many times I'd install something like python and it
would download X because of the dependencies the package builder
included. And once I went to uninstall Mozilla because I was using
firefox instead and it told me it would have to uninstall Gnome, again
because of the dependencies. So everytime I changed distros, I ended up
back at slackware.
My biggest problem with slackware though is the lack of "official"
packages for things like tomcat and postgresql, php, etc. and it
doesn't have as much of a "community" feel. The other problem I kept
facing is I would find a package for something like php, but it would be
compiled with mysql support and not postgresql, so I needed to compile
my own. Of course, all the while as I'm "playing" with these different
distros on my laptop and doing development, I'm thinking of the future
when my code will be "released" and I'll have a server to maintain. As
soon as I compile my own apps, I own those apps and have to ensure I
find security notifications and recompile in a timely fashion and do all
this manually. And this whole project is done in my spare time, and
there is not a lot of that for sure.
One day I tried Gentoo, despite all the install horror stories I heard.
It took me a while to install, but I fell in love with Gentoo right
away. It has a great community, the apps are up-to-date, and it will
compile everything according to how I want it. I don't really care
about the possible speed diff between compiling for i486 or i686 nor do
I care to play with the latest compiler optimizations, I just want the
configure options I need for the apps.
Now, the only problem I have is one day I update the portage tree and
upgrade my apps and suddenly I'm getting new things like bash and
libraries that I consider "core" parts of my system that I don't want
upgraded suddenly.
It seems every distro gets this wrong. Debian calls everything unstable
if it's a newer version, but it's stable branch is very stable, and
other distros make releases almost weekly and upgrade every part of the
system from the kernel on up. I hate to say it but Windows seems to
have it right here. New windows versions come up very infrequently,
although you get frequent security and bug "service packs". However, my
windows 2000 doesn't run 6 year old applications, it runs the latest
Eclipse and jdk and tomcat and apache and postgresql, because I need the
features of the latest versions.
So it seems to me there is an important distinction here. I want my
"base" operating system to be solid and dependable and change
infrequently (yet get security updates), but at the same time, user
applications need to be the latest version and I'm willing to accept
more risk to run the latest jdk or tomcat or eclipse because I need the
latest features, they don't need to be 6 years old to be called "stable".
All of that said, I haven't found the perfect distro yet, but Gentoo
seems to be the closest, missing only a more stable "release" portage
branch that only gets security updates and severe bug fixes, yet still
lets me get the absolute latest Eclipse and jdk. Currently I'm running
Slackware and have been experimenting with making my own SlackBuilds to
build packages from source, but it seems so redundant and I can't stop
wishing I had Gentoo. The other night I installed FreeBSD, but I
instantly miss Linux where I felt much more at home, but BSD does have
the build from source I need and also a more stable source tree. But I
miss emerge, and equery was about my favorite thing in the world, and
the Gentoo community just cannot be beat.: there are answers to
everything and tons of helpful people.
So, is there any hope for me? I thought maybe I'd send this email and
encourage your efforts towards Gentoo for servers and maybe put in a
request for small steps like a more stable portage tree. Anyway, thanks
for listening.
mike
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