Hamilton's response does not exclude the possibility that he and Edney & Symons 
are referring to two different meanings of "geoengineering", namely earth and 
civil engineering versus climate engineering. Considering that my daily Google 
Scholar alert on the keyword geoengineering returns a dozen publications from 
China on the latter, I believe this is likely the case.

-----------------------------------------
Jesse L. Reynolds, M.S.
PhD Candidate
European and International Public Law
Tilburg Sustainability Center
Tilburg University, The Netherlands
email: [email protected]
http://www.tilburguniversity.edu/webwijs/show/?uid=j.l.reynolds
http://twitter.com/geoengpolicy
________________________________
From: [email protected] [[email protected]] on 
behalf of Joshua Horton [[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, April 01, 2013 4:47 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Fwd: [geo] Re: Why geoengineering has immediate appeal to China 
(Guradian)

Passing along for Clive, whose message got bounced - I'll respond when I get a 
chance.

Josh

Sent from my iPhone

Begin forwarded message:

From: Clive Hamilton <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>
Date: April 1, 2013, 6:17:13 AM EDT
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>, 
[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>, Andrew Lockley 
<[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>, 
[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [geo] Re: Why geoengineering has immediate appeal to China 
(Guradian)

Dear All

Kingsley Edney and Jonathan Symons have written the definitive paper on 
geoengineering in China. They are Sinologists and have researched the question 
in great detail, as their paper shows. I was sent an early draft and it framed 
my understanding of the issue. Since then I have been in close contact with 
these two scholars, not least in asking them to read carefully and correct any 
mistakes or misinterpretations in my article that appeared in the Guardian.

The claims I made about geoengineering research in China are not in any way 
contradicted by the quotes provided by Josh or Fred, as they seem to imply. 
Indeed, it would be odd for Kingsley and Jonathan to both make the quoted 
statements and approve the article I had in the Guardian if they felt there was 
any contradiction.

The fact is that China has included geoengineering among its Earth science 
research priorities, and I don't understand why some participants in this group 
are going out of their way to downplay this fact.

In some unscripted comments I made in an earlier television interview I erred 
in exaggerating the degree of priority being given to geoengineering research 
in China. That is now corrected in the Guardian piece. Soon after my television 
comment Jason Blackstock emailed me saying I had got it completely wrong, that 
he is very well connected with Chinese scientists and officials, and that he is 
quite certain that there is no official endorsement of geoengineering in China. 
Those who think otherwise, he wrote, have mistranslated the relevant Chinese 
word. He has since conceded that Kingsley and Jonathan are right in their 
interpretation and in the facts regarding official inclusion of geoengineering, 
which ought to be no surprise since they know a lot more about China than he 
does.

Clive




On 1 April 2013 00:57, Josh Horton 
<[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Even more to the point, see this 
(http://www.scribd.com/doc/131811730/China-and-the-blunt-temptations-of-geoengineering-the-role-of-solar-radiation-management-in-China’s-strategic-response-to-climate-change)
 current draft article on China and geoengineering:

"Some Western scholars have expressed concern that China may already be working 
on unilateral research and implementation of SRM.  Although we cannot discount 
this possibility, we have found no evidence supporting this contention in 
published Chinese literature or our discussions with Chinese scientists.  In 
fact, consideration of SRM currently seems to be confined to epistemic 
communities that are deeply cautious about the possible downsides of deliberate 
intervention into natural systems." (p. 28)

Josh

On Wednesday, March 27, 2013 8:58:33 PM UTC-4, Fred Zimmerman wrote:
Before we go too far on this "China priorities meme" let me suggest that we 
make it a practice of the list to always cite Jason Blackstock's very 
persuasive post of 11/26/2012

https://groups.google.com/d/msg/geoengineering/wKAas01rdDA/h2eZpjmvviAJ

the "money quote" of which is this from Kingsley Edney:

So "geoengineering and global change" is one "important research direction" 
among a total of more than 50 that are listed in the field of earth science 
alone. Once we consider all the other categories of scientific research it 
seems quite possible that, as Blackstock claims, geoengineering would not make 
the top 100. If we focus solely on the narrower category of solar radiation 
management then there is no evidence to claim that SRM is a priority at this 
stage."

Fred


On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 7:23 PM, Bill Stahl <[email protected]> wrote:
The comments I have on this excellent article are:
1,  China is popularly used as an example of a country that will go it's own 
way on climate issues (and on anything else). This is natural- especially for 
an Australian like Hamilton! - but it's also true of Canada (as is sometimes 
overlooked in the battle over the Keystone pipeline). Rather than give up its 
tar sands it might be willing to be the first to take the plunge into 
geoengineering. And, unlike China, it has plenty of Arctic territory to give it 
both acute awareness of permafrost melting and easy entree into high-latitude 
SRM to cool the Arctic. Given the pace of Arctic melting that issue will be 
forced long, long before 2035, and because the directly affected zone is so 
much smaller than that of global SRM the governance barriers are lower (though 
still high). Canada is then at least as good a candidate for 'first adopter' as 
China.

2. That would not directly help China but Hamilton's description suggests that 
China's interests would lead it to support Canada (or any other high-latitude 
plunge-taker) to give itself more options later.

3. Hamilton's hypothetical 2035 scenario describes an interaction between China 
and the U.S. as one between two isolated states, as if the US would have 
available a practical option of shooting down planes. But there is no 
conceivable scenario in which only one country wants to do SRM, and none in 
which only one opposes it. Let's assume that a large number of low-lying 
countries (Pacific island states in particular) are ready to cool the Arctic & 
Greenland, as soon as possible - starting next Thursday afternoon if they can. 
These 10 or 20 states are shopping around for a larger state or states with the 
political and technical muscle to implement it - China and Canada, since we've 
already  mentioned them. A slew of mid-size players sign on for various 
reasons, leading to a coalition of 30 countries of varying size, location, 
wealth & motives. Those opposed or undecided will not be invited, as Caldeira 
et all described in a recent game theory paper.  At the risk of being flippant, 
let's say they give themselves a noble-sounding title - Alliance for Something 
or Other Virtuous With a Snappy Acronym - and they pick as their figurehead 
someone who can persuasively don the mantle of righteousness. The leader of an 
endangered atoll state would do nicely, even if some relatively 'unsympathetic' 
country such as China is the real muscle.

What will stop them? Surely not some moratorium voted out of a UN committee 
room a decade or two before. Shooting down planes? Imagine some nation's 
networks interrupting their regular programming for a Presidential 
announcement: "I have today authorized our armed forces to take action against 
Fiji, China, Malaysia, American Samoa, Mongolia, Zanzibar, Finland, The 
Seychelles and ... oh to hell with it, lots of others".

Although I'm unsympathetic to those who oppose any geoengineering research as 
starting down a slippery slope to full deployment, I have to admit they have a 
point.





On Saturday, March 23, 2013 6:26:35 PM UTC-6, andrewjlockley wrote:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2013/mar/22/geoengineering-china-climate-change

Why geoengineering has immediate appeal to China
Beijing wants to cut emissions without hindering growth and avert a
revolt from a population under extreme climate stress

Clive Hamilton professor of public ethics at Charles Sturt University
in Canberra
Friday 22 March 2013 14.01 GMT

The political dilemma over geoengineering – deliberate, large-scale
intervention in the climate system designed to counter global warming
or offset some of its effects – will perhaps be most acute in China.

In December, the country listed geoengineering among its Earth science
research priorities, in a marked shift in the international climate
change landscape noticed by China specialists Kingsley Edney and
Jonathan Symons.

On the one hand, China's rapid economic growth has seen a huge
escalation in its greenhouse gas emissions, which on an annual basis
overtook those of the United States five years ago. Sustained GDP
growth provides China's Communist party with its only claim to
legitimacy, its "mandate of heaven". China's efforts to constrain the
growth of its emissions have been substantial, and certainly put to
shame those of many developed nations.

Yet neither China's efforts nor those of other countries over the next
two or three decades are likely to do much to slow the warming of the
globe, nor halt the climate disruption that will follow. Global
emissions have not been declining or even slowing. In fact, global
emissions are accelerating. Even the World Bank, which for years has
been criticised for promoting carbon-intensive development, now warns
that we are on track for 4C of warming, which would change everything.

China is highly vulnerable to water shortages in the north, with
declining crop yields and food price rises expected, and storms and
flooding in the east and south. Climate-related disasters in China are
already a major source of social unrest so there is a well-founded
fear in Beijing that the impacts of climate change in the provinces
could topple the government in the capital. Natural disasters
jeopardise its mandate.

So what can the Chinese government do? Continued growth in greenhouse
gas emissions is a condition for its hold on power, but climate
disruption in response to emissions growth threatens to destabilise
it.

Geoengineering has immediate appeal as a way out of this catch-22.
While a variety of technologies to take carbon out of the air or to
regulate sunlight are being researched, at present by far the most
likely intervention would involve blanketing the Earth with a layer of
sulphate particles to block some incoming solar radiation.

Spraying sulphate aerosols could mask warming and cool the planet
within weeks, although it would not solve the core problem of too much
carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and oceans.

Scientists and policy-makers in China have been watching the debate
over geoengineering unfold in the US and Europe where there has been a
boom in discussion and research since the taboo was lifted in 2006,
following an intervention by Nobel laureate Paul Crutzen calling for
investigation of "plan B".

In the US, there have been several high-level reports arguing for more
research into geoengineering — the National Research Council, the
House of Representatives' committee on science and technology and the
Government Accountability Office. Influential Beltway thinktanks, like
the Bipartisan Policy Center, have joined the fray. Plan B is being
discussed in the White House, and the military is keeping a watching
brief, and maybe doing more.

China's decision to initiate a research programme could be motivated
by no more than a desire to develop a national capacity to keep
abreast of what is happening in the rest of the world. Certainly,
there is a good deal of scepticism about geoengineering within China's
scientific community.

Yet as the world remains paralysed by the scale of the warming crisis,
and watches while it becomes locked-in, the capacity to implement an
emergency response will become ever-more attractive. And in a global
emergency — a crippling drought, the Amazon ablaze, Greenland
collapsing — the gaze becomes focussed on the urgent to the exclusion
of all else, including the interests of other, less-powerful nations
whose plight may be worsened if a major power decided to regulate the
Earth's climate system.

While western nations are not ruled by one-party states determined to
maintain power at all costs, in truth the tyranny of the economic
system is no less absolute. The 2008 financial crisis and its
aftermath demonstrated that the structures of power that underpin the
system — the banks, the markets, the major corporations and their ties
to the political system — are extremely resilient, perhaps every bit
as resistant to change as China's Communist party.

After all, when it comes to responding to climate disruption every
report and recommendation — from the Stern report to the IPCC —
assumes that measures to reduce greenhouse gas emissions must
accommodate the first imperative, maintaining the rate of economic
growth, even though it is GDP growth that escalates greenhouse gas
emissions.

So here is a plausible scenario for 2035. Facing a revolt from a
population under extreme climate stress, the Chinese government seeks
the US government's consent to cool the planet by spraying sulphate
aerosols into the stratosphere. Popular protests prevent Washington
endorsing the plan but it tacitly agrees not to shoot down China's
planes. That would be enough, and from that point there would be no
going back.

• Clive Hamilton professor of public ethics at Charles Sturt
University in Canberra and the author of Earthmasters: The dawn of the
age of climate engineering, just published by Yale University Press.

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Professor of Public Ethics
Charles Sturt University
www.clivehamilton.com<http://www.clivehamilton.com>

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