Surely the debate about the Sun has been over with respect to the last
30 years, even without such work. And, wouldn't this paper imply
underestimate of climate positive feedbacks? Which would not be good
news.


I'm approaching this from the point of view of someone who's been
dealing with 'sceptic' arguments on public discussion groups. So I'm
fully aware that attribution studies are the only scientific approach.
But as the 'contrarist faithful' don't like models. I've had to try to
argue without reference to them.

Prior apologies to any proper scientists here.


I've zoomed in on GISS' summary of 2005 temperatures for the following
'soundbyte'. http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/2005/

"Global warming is now 0.6°C in the past three decades and 0.8°C in
the past century. It is no longer correct to say that "most global
warming occurred before 1940". More specifically, there was slow global
warming, with large fluctuations, over the century up to 1975 and
subsequent rapid warming of almost 0.2°C per decade." CRU find a
lesser increase - but I've always used GISS as most of the sceptics
I've encountered have.


Just some examples,

Lean 2000 et al:
http://www.junkscience.com/Greenhouse/irradiance.gif

Friis-Christensen, E., and K. Lassen (1991), Length of the solar
cycle:An indicator of solar activity closely associated with climate,
Science,254, 698-700. Shown wrong by Damon & Laut:
http://www.realclimate.org/damon&laut_2004.pdf 192kb pdf I quote from
there,
"If Friis-Christensen and Lassen [1991] had been correct, there should
have been 11 global warming events during that time equivalent to the
contemporaneous event. However, the current event is unique and
obviously of anthropogenic origin." Once their work is corrected, as it
is by Damon & Laut, there is no trend ín the last 30 years.

Usoskin 2003,
http://cc.oulu.fi/%7Eusoskin/personal/Sola2-PRL_published.pdf 191kb pdf
Wiggles, no indication of up or down trend.

Muscheler 2005,
http://www.cgd.ucar.edu/ccr/raimund/publications/Muscheler_et_al_Nature2005.pdf
593kb pdf No current trend especially in view of the size of past
deviations.

Graph of GCR counts
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=42
temperature beige lines GCR bue & brown, Reducing trend.

Neutron counter data:
http://ulysses.sr.unh.edu/NeutronMonitor/Misc/neutron2.html
No overall trend, it's intensity follows the pattern of sunspot cycles.

To which I might be adding Scafetta/West 2006, got to read again but on
first read: Figure 2, doesn't explain the last 30 years, indeed they
note: "Note the good correspondence of the patterns in particular
during the pre-industrial era (1600-
1900) and the significant discrepancy occurring in the 20th century
with a clear surplus warming." However they also say: "For example, the
temperature record peaks around 1950 while the solar temperature
signature shown in Figure 2 peaks around 1960, however, by adopting a
different TSI proxy reconstruction [e.g., Hoyt and Schatten, 1997], the
two peaks would almost coincide." Statements like that mean I don't
like relying on the paper, what kind of theory requires one to shift
datasets to hold the argument together? But it's been quoted to me by a
'sceptic' (as opposed to the loonies on many discussion groups), who's
honestly taking on my argument and finding the last 30 years issue
troubling.


Is anyone else finding that the sceptics are becoming more and more
like YEC/ID adherents, or the 9/11 fantasists?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbsn/F2801717?thread=3061727&skip=1520&show=20#p40558931
(The Archsceptic character is a published research scientist and an
Associate Director of Research at a British university.)


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