On Thu, 28 Nov 2019 00:31:45 +0100 Jean wrote: > > On Wed, 27 Nov 2019 08:05:50 +0100 Jean wrote: > > > It is > > > system of preparing software on the computer, but is not > > > distribution. > > On Wed, 27 Nov 2019 08:05:50 +0100 Jean wrote: > > > Distribution should have capacity to be duplicated > > > > that is a rather narrow categorization of a distribution - > > I never said that > is the only characteristic of distribution. > > Both can be duplicated, so I don't see what you are pointing > out
because you claimed that a source-based distro is "not a distribution"; i was pointing out thet whether in source or binary form, it is a distribution just the same those preparations are really the majority the of work involved in making a distro, and they are what most uniquely distinguish that distro from some other - after the preparations are complete, all that remains is to run the build scripts, which is essentially a "hands-free" procedure, requiring little to no effort nor knowledge on the part of the person who does that final step - it make no practical difference whether that person is one of the distro maintainers or the end-user - when the distro maintainers provide ready-to-use binary packages, that is merely a convenience to the end-user, albeit a convenience that people have come to take for granted On Thu, 28 Nov 2019 00:31:45 +0100 Jean wrote: > Don't let users download > non-free software to make free software out of it. parabola devs strongly disagree with that - we want everyone to have access to everything that the ditsro devs had - no one should be required to do so, and perhaps distros should not provide those non-FSDG sources; but you must "let them download non-free software", because that is one's personal business, and there is no way to prevent it anyways - permitting something to happen is very different than requiring that it be so if there is anything vague to clarify regarding the FSDG on this issue, it is not about "allowing" nor "requiring" to download non-FSDG sources - it is clear that FSDG distro can not require that - it should also be clear that there is no way to prevent it; so "allowing" is granted as non-negotiable - the vagueness is only the question of: "does publishing liberation scripts (in any form) necessarily recommend that they be used", and "would recommending that they be used, run afoul with the FSDG?" in order to be useful, they all necessarily require the non-FSDG sources to be acquired by the user of the script somehow; but its not obvious that merely publishing them would be a recommendation of their use thats the only reason i made that subtle distinction about the core system component being ready to automate the download and execution of liberation scripts, or if that must be a non-standard, manual exercise, unlikely to be done inadvertently - it not because they are fundamentally different from a freedom perspective; but that they are different from the "recommending" or "assisting" perspective On Thu, 28 Nov 2019 00:31:45 +0100 Jean wrote: > If I, as user, get the liberating scripts > It gives > me chance to have it on my mediums, and even the chance to > share non-free software. to be fair, thats not quite correct - it is the authors of that software, that gave you the chance to download it and share it - what the liberation scripts give you, is the ability to clean them up per the FSDG, and to use them in that form we must be very precise not to confuse "software that does not meet the FSDG" with "non-free software" - the FSDG is entirely pertaining to what distro maintainers must do on behalf of users; so that users can get a 100% free system without taking those preparation steps themselves - currently all FSDG satisfy that, or they would not be endorsed in the first place this issue is more subtle - it is asking: "is it permissible for distro maintainers to allow, recommend, or assist users in accomplishing those FSDG tasks for themselves?" - those things will indeed involve handling "software that does not meet the FSDG"; but that is very different than "obtaining any non-free information for practical use", which is all that the FSDG actually says on the matter On Thu, 28 Nov 2019 00:31:45 +0100 Jean wrote: > such could/should be packaged in the distribution for anybody > to be able to prepare the distribution, I have never mentioned > any elites this is probably just a language confusion - that is interpreted as: "the liberation scripts should be used only for the purpose of maintaining the distro" - if that is the case, then it follows that those scripts could be used only by the distro maintainers, and that users should not use them for any purpose, because users do not "prepare the distro" - that puts the distro maintainers in an elite position i dont think that was your intended meaning - i think we all agree that users should be able to help the distro maintainers to "prepare the distro" - in order to do that, they must run the liberation scripts, and they must acquire the non-FSDG sources somehow
