John, Thanks for the detailed information; out of curiosity, where on a typical Mac filesystem will this setting be stored?
David > On Sep 13, 2018, at 10:36 AM, John Ralls <jra...@ceridwen.us> wrote: > > Adrien, > > The new user dialog opens if there’s no file to open and a preference hasn’t > been set; running the dialog sets the preference. It offers to run the NAHSA, > the QIF import assistant, or to run a new user tutorial (which actually just > opens the T&CG at the table of contents). > > To see it on your mac, do > defaults write org.gnucash.Gnucash > /org/gnucash/dialogs/new-user/first-startup "1" > /Applications/Gnucash.app/Contents/MacOS/Gnucash --nofile > > You might try starting GnuCash with --nofile on your new VM to see if that > triggers it. If so it means that for some reason gnc_get_file_to_load() is > returning something besides NULL. > > It’s currently not possible to have GnuCash running without an open session > and accompanying book, even if the book doesn’t even have a root account. > That leads to having the “save” button lighted and being asked to save when > there’s nothing to save. > > Regards, > John Ralls > > >> On Sep 13, 2018, at 7:09 AM, Adrien Monteleone >> <adrien.montele...@lusfiber.net> wrote: >> >> Just tested in a Xubuntu 18.04 vm. >> >> I got the tip of the day overlaid on the splash screen. I closed the tip >> dialog, the splash screen disappeared and the main GnuCash window appeared. >> >> It’s blank save for the menu and two buttons, one to save the current file >> and one to close the currently active page. (whatever that means) >> >> Here’s a screenshot: https://imgur.com/a/HIitCFN >> >> I didn’t think an actual book exists here, but the title bar does say >> ‘unsaved book’ at the top. >> >> Clicking the “Close the currently active page” button does nothing. (perhaps >> because there is no currently active page) >> >> Clicking the “Save File” button brings up a save file dialog. Completing >> this saves the file, changes the title bar to now say, in this case, >> ’test.gnucash - Gnucash’ but otherwise does nothing. The NAHSA doesn’t run. >> There’s zero indication what the user is supposed to do at this point. >> >> So if there is supposed to be a ‘Welcome’ screen to guide the user on >> getting started, it isn’t firing. Is this new for 3.x? >> >> Note, this test was done using 2.6.19-1 which was in the bionic repos so I’m >> not going to file a bug on this, but I’ll next build a fresh copy of 3.2 and >> see what happens. >> >> Regards, >> Adrien >> >>> On Sep 13, 2018, at 8:36 AM, Adrien Monteleone >>> <adrien.montele...@lusfiber.net> wrote: >>> >>> There’s a “Welcome to GnuCash!” screen? I don’t think I’ve ever seen it. >>> I’m going to test in a vm and see what happens. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Adrien >>> >>>> On Sep 13, 2018, at 8:33 AM, David T. <sunfis...@yahoo.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Adrien, >>>> >>>> I just tried using a new login on my Mac to run a newly-downloaded copy of >>>> GnuCash, and I also found myself staring at a blank screen after startup. >>>> >>>> Having just worked on the documentation for the “Welcome to GnuCash!” >>>> screen, I am curious to know *when* that screen actually runs? Does >>>> GnuCash have some hidden element that knows that it has been run on any >>>> login of my Mac, or is this aspect broken? Seems a shame to have a welcome >>>> mat at the front door, and then have everyone use the service entrance. >>>> >>>> David >>>> >>>>> On Sep 13, 2018, at 8:53 AM, Adrien Monteleone >>>>> <adrien.montele...@lusfiber.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I was going to mention this in my reply to David Cousens but didn’t want >>>>> to hijack the thread. >>>>> >>>>> The greatest source of confusion I’ve seen from new users personally is >>>>> the blank screen you see on first run with no indication what to do next. >>>>> (unless this has changed with 3.x, I haven’t started a ‘fresh’ copy of >>>>> GnuCash in some time) >>>>> >>>>> Perhaps if this screen offered buttons for “Open existing book” or >>>>> “Create new book” that then launches the appropriate assistant(s) could >>>>> work well here. >>>>> >>>>> Does this fall in line with what you mentioned about ‘first screen’ or >>>>> was that the ‘first screen of the assistant’? >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> Adrien >>>>> >>>>>> On Sep 13, 2018, at 7:41 AM, D <sunfis...@yahoo.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hello, >>>>>> >>>>>> Having raised yet another ruckus on the lists regarding documentation, I >>>>>> will back off altogether, and work to write documentation on the >>>>>> assistant as it is, taking care to balance the needs of the different >>>>>> user groups. >>>>>> >>>>>> My only final comment is to note that it is unfortunate that this >>>>>> assistant is what all users see when they click File->New. Perhaps the >>>>>> idea of adding buttons on the first screen for Business and Personal >>>>>> setup (along with a modification in sequencing for the latter option) >>>>>> could be implemented with minor developer effort? >>>>>> >>>>>> I have a greater appreciation for the many different perspectives in the >>>>>> community, and thank everyone for their input. >>>>>> >>>>>> David >>>>>> >>>>>> On September 13, 2018, at 8:10 AM, Adrien Monteleone >>>>>> <adrien.montele...@lusfiber.net> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> David, >>>>>> >>>>>> I agree on all points. >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards, >>>>>> Adrien >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sep 12, 2018, at 10:19 PM, David Cousens <davidcous...@bigpond.com> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Adrien, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> While I agree with the concept David T is proposing to streamline the >>>>>>> process for new users and the thrust of your >>>>>>> comments about the new user experience, the new account heirarchy at >>>>>>> least as it is currently implemented, will be used >>>>>>> by anyone creating a new set of books, whether they are experienced >>>>>>> Gnucash users, experienced accountants, total >>>>>>> newbies or someone transferring from another program. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As a newbie you can get a perfectly usable set of accounts for >>>>>>> exploring Gnucash by simply clicking Next through the >>>>>>> assistant then Apply and then saving the file. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Perhaps this needs to be made clearer to new users as well as informing >>>>>>> them that any choices they make can be changed >>>>>>> later (except for the very few cases where this is not possible - I >>>>>>> can't think of any but I personally don't currently >>>>>>> use the full capabilty set of GnuCash's features but I used more in the >>>>>>> past). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If this was done up front, they could then easily skip through. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The suggestion John made of creating a simplified new file option with >>>>>>> defaults based on the locale and an advanced >>>>>>> setup option using the NAHS Assistant seems to meet this need as well. >>>>>>> Even knowing what you want in a CoA requires a >>>>>>> fair understanding of your accounting needs as well as the >>>>>>> functionality of GnuCash. Alternatively in other posts I >>>>>>> think both Frank and I have suggested a checkbox which by default >>>>>>> disables selecting those options which a new user is >>>>>>> going to find confusing and provides default values. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I would have thought the CoA setup is not too bad. It comes with the >>>>>>> common accounts selected, it does perhaps give the >>>>>>> new user a view that there is a lot more to explore. Some new users >>>>>>> will be looking for business functionality and other >>>>>>> "advanced " functionality from the get go. There will always be a few >>>>>>> new users who will be confused by having to start >>>>>>> the program. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Personally when evaluating software, I jump in without reading manuals >>>>>>> first because I figure if the interface isn't >>>>>>> intuitive to a decent extent, I am not going to want to go too much >>>>>>> further, unless I really have no other option. >>>>>>> Intuitive for an experienced computer user can however be very >>>>>>> different for someone with limited experience. My wife >>>>>>> never reads manuals ever, she just asks me. I on the other hand consult >>>>>>> my 5 year old grand daughter. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I share Mechtilde's concern that in making things easier for the new >>>>>>> user we don't lose functionality for the >>>>>>> experienced user. We should hopefully look for mechanisms for doing >>>>>>> both. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> David Cousens >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, 2018-09-12 at 10:33 -0500, Adrien Monteleone wrote: >>>>>>>> As someone who has helped other people get started using GnuCash (and >>>>>>>> remembering my own first steps) I agree >>>>>>>> completely with these points. Those book preferences are not self >>>>>>>> explanatory. (perhaps bugs in their own right) A new >>>>>>>> user is left to either trust the defaults and move on, pause and >>>>>>>> revisit the startup process several times while they >>>>>>>> track down help info and digest it, or give up in frustration. (I’ve >>>>>>>> seen the latter three times—you may or not be >>>>>>>> surprised how many people do *not* want to read a book before they >>>>>>>> start using a piece of software, I chose the second >>>>>>>> option personally) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Unless the startup assistant (wizard, druid, whatever) can be >>>>>>>> redesigned as an explanatory walk through to choose >>>>>>>> these settings, that part should be removed and the defaults chosen >>>>>>>> for the user. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> As for trading accounts, I turned them on after the fact for tracking >>>>>>>> commodities as additional currencies. I’ve never >>>>>>>> bought or sold any since doing that, but I’ve played with turning the >>>>>>>> setting on and off to experiment with the >>>>>>>> setting’s effect on some reports and I’ve never noticed any issues. >>>>>>>> (but again, I only have opening balance >>>>>>>> transactions in each currency) If turning Trading Accounts off after >>>>>>>> entering buy/sell transactions is bad news, then >>>>>>>> I would think the option to do so should be disabled. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>>> Adrien >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Sep 12, 2018, at 9:38 AM, David T. via gnucash-devel >>>>>>>>> <gnucash-devel@gnucash.org> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hello, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> As I begin the process of migrating text from the Help to the Guide >>>>>>>>> (cf. Bug 796855), I am working on the Help >>>>>>>>> information regarding the New Account Hierarchy Setup (NAHS) >>>>>>>>> assistant, and I have a couple of questions about the >>>>>>>>> second screen of the assistant, the “New Book Options” screen. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> First off, while I respect the intent to allow users the option to >>>>>>>>> set these preferences from the creation of their >>>>>>>>> file, I wonder whether this is misguided. To wit: all of these >>>>>>>>> options are quite technical in nature, and all of >>>>>>>>> them can be set at a later point by opening the appropriate >>>>>>>>> preferences. Adding these options here adds complexity >>>>>>>>> that can easily be deferred to a later point. While it is true that >>>>>>>>> this assistant runs whenever a user chooses >>>>>>>>> File->New (meaning that an experienced user might wish to add these >>>>>>>>> settings from the assistant), I am willing to >>>>>>>>> hazard a guess that most users will invoke this assistant *only* when >>>>>>>>> they first start using GnuCash, and *only* >>>>>>>>> when their heads are already swimming with the overwhelming >>>>>>>>> experience that is GnuCash. Asking a new user to choose >>>>>>>>> whether to use Trading Accounts or to Use Split Action Field for >>>>>>>>> Number is IMHO pointless. They aren’t going to be >>>>>>>>> able to make an informed decision. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> <aside>I’ll note that this becomes an obvious issue when I attempt to >>>>>>>>> write the help section for the screen. I am >>>>>>>>> left either with writing a huge explanatory section on the details of >>>>>>>>> each of these settings, which detracts from >>>>>>>>> the flow of the NAHS narrative, or with adding a generic note that >>>>>>>>> advises users to accept the defaults and read >>>>>>>>> about the details in other sections of the Guide.</aside> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> So, for the new user, the only real effect of this screen is to >>>>>>>>> introduce confusion and questions. Can it be removed >>>>>>>>> from the assistant? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Related to this screen, my second question has to do with the “Use >>>>>>>>> Trading Accounts” setting. Can it be turned off >>>>>>>>> once it has been enabled in a given GnuCash file? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ISTR that this option is a one-way street—i.e., that, once turned on, >>>>>>>>> it can not be turned off again. Is this still >>>>>>>>> the case? If it is still true, then I would strongly suggest that >>>>>>>>> this option shouldn’t be placed on the NAHS >>>>>>>>> Assistant, since a new user won’t be aware of this. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> David >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> gnucash-devel mailing list >>>>>>>>> gnucash-devel@gnucash.org >>>>>>>>> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> gnucash-devel mailing list >>>>>>>> gnucash-devel@gnucash.org >>>>>>>> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> gnucash-devel mailing list >>>>>> gnucash-devel@gnucash.org >>>>>> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> gnucash-devel mailing list >>>>> gnucash-devel@gnucash.org >>>>> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> gnucash-devel mailing list >> gnucash-devel@gnucash.org >> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel > > _______________________________________________ > gnucash-devel mailing list > gnucash-devel@gnucash.org > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel _______________________________________________ gnucash-devel mailing list gnucash-devel@gnucash.org https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel
