Hi Cornel, We know you are a bright and an articulate Goan. So, if you want to share your thoughts with us, please feel free to do so. You do not have to create a straw man, to aim your arguments against. You have misrepresented my comments and placed my train of thoughts completely out of context. Below each paragraph of yours are my responses. Kind Regards, GL
------------ cornel wrote: CD: I am afraid you are incorrect in your understanding of "ground realities" especially when you use the word "caste" entirely a misnomer in America, as somehow equivalent to the concept of caste in India. Instead of your word "caste" in America, the terms ethnic minorities, community groups, hyphenated Americans, newcomers or even new social classes would definitely be more appropriate in your hopeful search for an appropriate term to make your point re America. GL Response: After I used the word "caste" in America, I had in parentheses what I meant (each immigrant group). So I had done exactly what you suggested. Perhaps "great minds think alike".:=)) ----------------------- CD: On another point, you seem to suggest, incorrectly that, lower caste groups in India are happy to stay within their low status position by wearing caste on their sleeves, in clearly, your unmistakable apology for caste. The very substantial literature on caste in India does not support your commonsense view at all. There are several ways lower caste groups have historically opted for mobility within the caste structure or endeavored to get out of their caste groups. Minimally, if you read outstanding research by Scrinivas you will note that he has talked about intentional processes like westernization, sanskritization and change of religion as means to get out of the binds of traditional Hindu caste. GL Response: The above paragraph is irrelevant, because I did NOT suggest what you claim I "seem to suggest". See below for my contrarian point to what you say I said. ------------------------ CD: Others have been more radical politically and are treating caste and casteism as racist on the global scene. They are making good progress even though India, refused, for now, to admit casteism as racism at the last international conference on racism (in 2004, from memory) held in Durban, South Africa. GL Response: Feel free to let your thoughts stand on its own feet without a bogey man - a technique used by a few on Goanet. If you think that caste in India is not being "used radical politically" you are mistaken. In fact that was the thrust of the original post. Hence without your reference to my writings, you appear to endorse what I have written. You may hate to admit it. -------------------- CD: No Gilbert, the smart guys you so deride are much smarter than you think! You have also persisted in repeating your erroneous view in this post, about a relative static and unchanging caste situation in India. So let me be of some help re essential reading for you, from a small selection (non alphabetically presented) of my books on caste from my home bookshelf. After all, Goanet is a learning instrument: GL Response: I did not suggest that caste was static. In fact I made the opposite point. It was how the caste-groups in India (including lower caste) and elsewhere are using their identity and numbers to gain political clout , empower their social rights and gain an increased share of the economic pie. And I encouraged Goans to use that model. So thanks for your endorsement of my views and your references. Surprise, Surprise, we are both progressives.:=)) --------------------------- CD: Finally, Gilbert, to make sense of how minorities adjust in their new destinations of migration you will find the next two books particularly illuminating. The first relates to the UK. The second, has excellent historical material about what you call mainstreaming in the USA. GL Response: Thanks for the references. -------------------- CD: Very best regards and hopefully, pleasant reading. GL Response: The same to you, when you read my posts. You do not have to distort other peoples' writings to make your point. In fact you should / could build on other peoples' views to expand the perspective. Again thanks for agreeing with my "simplistic views". Imagine that!!! :=)) Regards, GL. _______________________________________________ Goanet mailing list [email protected] http://lists.goanet.org/listinfo.cgi/goanet-goanet.org
