Very interesting.
Speaking of caste, where did it spring from?
Most agree it originated with the Hindus but, with things Hindu, there
is no clear, uncontested historical narrative. They prefer to grope in
the shadows of myth & legend - anything outside rational scrutiny.
Here's one account I read:
The Hindus venerate an old seer called Manu: who is he? When did he
live? We don't know and the Hindus can't enlighten us. He is supposed to
have devised a code or laws to govern society called the /Laws of Manu/.
He assigned people occupations according to /caste/.
The Rig Veda describes how Brahma, the creator of the world, was born in
a golden egg. "In/ order to protect this universe, He the most
resplendent one assigned separate (duties and) occupation to those who
sprang from his mouth, arms, thighs, and feet/." (/The Laws of Manu/, /24)./
Manu then added: /The Brahmin was his mouth; his two arms were made of
the rajanya (warrior/Kshatriya), his two thighs the Vaishyas (traders
and farmers), from his feet the shudra (servile class).
/
This classification has been accepted over the centuries. Nobody
(scholar, academic, philosopher) has rejected it as being weird,
ridiculous or irrational. No public intellectual or think tank
challenges it. No public discussion or debate is held.That's the Indian
way...
Dr Ambedkar in his book /Annihilation of Caste/, argues that the *caste
system makes Hindu society uniquely incapable of freedom, liberty,
equality and fraternity.*Stated with brutal honesty,*it is basically* *a
primitive (feudal) society driven by weird rituals and guided by
assorted godmen and gurus*./Rational thinking has no role here.
/It required foreigners (the British) to outlaw the barbaric customs of
*/sati/ (*burning of widows//on the husband’s pyre)//and
*/thugee/*// (the ritual murder of innocent people to propitiate the
gods) in the 18^th century.*
Naipaul*wrote in the 1960s: "*/Magic and thoughtless rituals are an
Indian need. They simplify the world and make up for the intellectual
failure – less a failure of the individual intellect than the deficiency
of a closed civilisation, ruled by myth and ritual./*/" /
Until the *rationality* comes to be appreciated by the Hindus,*modernity
will continue elude them.*
*
*
*Eddie*
/
/
/
/
On Tuesday, 25 July 2017, 17:07, Frederick Noronha
<[email protected]> wrote:
I'd see it as more complex than that, Mervyn. Caste doesn't seem to be
going away in any hurry. And the human race seems to be thriving on
building and steadfastly sustaining hierarchies of one form or another.
These issues need to be continually studied and talked about. Taking the
liberty of sharing this post on Goanet. Thanks to John for reminding me
about what I had forgotten I'd written!
FN
On 25 July 2017 at 21:30, Mervyn Maciel
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
wrote:
> We live in the 21st century and some of these out-dated
> customs/traditions -
> especially those that portray women in an inferior role should be
> consigned to history.
> Personally speaking, I am ashamed to find that we, who call ourselves
> Christians,still cling
> to the age old and, to my mind, 'obscene' customs of caste and dowry.
> At the risk of incurring the wrath of some(maybe), I feel equality
> should be
> the name of the game.
> Though not in any way connected with marriage, I might mention that
> even here
> in Britain, some top women broadcasters have sent an open letter to the
> Director
> General of the BBC, demanding equal pay for men and women who do the same
> job.
> (This was after the BBC published the salaries of top BBC earners - Chris
> Evans being
> the most highly paid -some £2million for a radio chat show.
>
>
>
> Mervyn Maciel
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 25, 2017 at 3:35 PM, John J. D'Souza <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
> wrote:
>
>> Fred,
>>
>>
>> FYI - have things changed since ?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *"GOAN WOMEN COMPLAIN" WOMEN IN GOA FIND MARRIAGE CUSTOMS WEIGH HEAVY ON
>> THEM*
>>
>>
>> For: GOA NEWS
>> Posted by: Fred Noronha, Mon, 29 Jul 1996
>>
>> Panaji: Marriage customs weigh heavily on Catholic brides, and are
biased
>> against women coming from the community in Goa. This goes largely
unnoticed
>> though, and discrimination comes under a sophisticated guise for a
section
>> which appears to be rather 'Westernised' and 'modern', say
campaigners of a
>> local women's group who did a study of this problem.
>>
>> "Marriage customs are important indicators, we feel. It reflects the
>> power-play that goes on in the other spheres of a woman's life too,"
argues
>> lecturer Sabina Martins, a campaigner for one of Goa's womens groups
>> Bailancho Saad, or "Women's Voice".
>>
>> Members of the Saad recently conducted a study based on actual marriages
>> taking place in the predominantly Catholic taluka of Salcete in
South Goa.
>> Their conclusions were stark. Behind the glamour of drink-and-eats
filled
>> celebrations which carry on for hours together, there is another
reality to
>> the marriages taking place here.
>>
>> Seemingly small tokenistic traditions manage to repeatedly underline the
>> less-than-equal position of the woman. Campaigners of the Saad point out
>> that this situation is not restricted to Catholic women alone in
Goa. But
>> patterns in different communities obviously differ.
>>
>> For Catholic marriages in Goa, whether the match flows from love, is
>> based on the choice of either party, or is worked out someone else, the
>> burden is traditionally placed on the girl's family from the start. They
>> have to officially and formally go to the would- be groom's place to
>> finalise the choice. "This creates a false sense of superiority for the
>> groom," believes Bailancho Saad spokesperson advocate Albertina Almeida.
>> She adds: "Such an approach smacks of someone asking a favour and
the other
>> performing the magnanimous gesture of granting it."
>>
>> After this too, the dice is loaded in favour of the hubby-to-be. If the
>> proposal is accepted, his family visits the girl's place. In
finalising the
>> match, the girl's consent is among the last priority.
>>
>> Often sought-after qualities in men are religion, the family's status,
>> educational background and even caste. But in addition to these
>> "qualities", the bride is also expected to have good looks, a
knowledge of
>> culinary skills, housekeeping, be preferably employed and offering some
>> dowry.
>>
>> Once the approval is obtained from both sides, the girl's family again
>> calls on to finalise the "terms" of the marriage, and its arrangements.
>> Dowry demands are usually made at this juncture.
>>
>> Earlier it used to be in cash. Now it could be in gold, jewellery,
>> cupboards and or even sweets for distribution to the neighbours,
flowers,
>> fruits and bread. Needless to say, no such items are expected from the
>> groom. Demands are placed rather subtly. Sometimes, this is rendered
>> redundant, since care is taken earlier on to ensure that the match
is made
>> with a bride of the "right" social grouping.
>>
>> Dates for the marriage are subsequently fixed with the groom's family's
>> convenience in mind.
>>
>> Then, Catholic brides have for their trousseau the white gown --
>> symbolising virginity, chastity and purity. But the groom has no
saratorial
>> equivalent. Brides can also be subject to critical comments when their
>> trousseau is publicly exhibited for the people to see at the bride's
home.
>> Once these are taken to the groom's place, petty fights over the
value of
>> the engagement ring or such matters are not unknown, says the Bailancho
>> Saad's study.
>>
>> Similarly, once the bride's husband dies, she is not supposed to wear
>> bright colours by tradition in Goa. Bangles are donned at the girl's
>> uncle's home, and these are to be broken on the husband's coffin, in
case
>> the wife outlives the husband.
>>
>> Bailancho Saad, which is one of the prominent women's groups in Goa
>> active here for over the past decade, felt that at times even
religion is
>> used to give the bride a raw deal.
>>
>> At some marriages Biblical readings chosen specially call on wives
to "be
>> loyal to your husband". This despite the fact there are many other
>> non-discriminatory readings in the sacred text to choose from, notes the
>> women's group. Some priests of the old-school of thought also stress
upon
>> the wife to be submissive, loyal, obedient and face tribulations
silently,
>> while forgetting to give similar advice to the groom.
>>
>> Women's campaigners here also point out that discrimination against
women
>> -- though probably not as stark as elsewhere -- takes on a sophisticated
>> form in this well-educated state.
>>
>> On paper, Goa is supposed to have a "uniform" civil code, a legacy
of the
>> Portuguese. In practice, different communities (and even caste
groups) have
>> differing laws. And though the law here provided women equal rights to
>> inheritance, social pressures ensure that most sign-off these rights in
>> favour of their brothers, husbands or fathers.
>>
>> Women have absolutely no say in the commonly-held village lands (called
>> "gaunkari" or "communidade" here), in which the menfolk from among the
>> early dominant settlers of the area inherit rights automatically on
>> entering their teens.
>>
>> Due to large-scale emigration among Catholics here for employment in
>> other parts of the country, and specially abroad, women- headed
households
>> have become a markedly visible reality among the minority community in
>> parts of the state. But here women are called upon play an important
role
>> not out of choice, but simply out of necessity. And that too, only
as long
>> as their menfolk are absent, says the Bailancho Saad.
>> "Some use the argument that we (Catholic women) are better off. Just
>> because there are others who are worse off than us, it does not mean
that
>> we are not facing discrimination," argues Ms. Martins.
>>
>> Of late, things seem to be improving in some ways though, she concedes.
>> Education has spread, and girls are doing very well in certain spheres.
>> Women's groups have been campaigning here over a number of issues for
>> nearly a decade. Media support, sometimes, has been forthcoming.
People are
>> turning wary about asking for dowry, showing a change in perceptions
too.
>> But is this change sufficient, and speedy enough? (#) --FN
>>
>> FREDERICK NORONHA
>>
>> H No 784, Saligao 403511 Goa Ph: 0832-276190/278683
>>
>> Fax: C/o 0832-263305 E-mail: [email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> John J. D'Souza
>>
>>
>>
>
--
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
_/
_/ Frederick Noronha +91-9822122436
_/ (Please SMS if you can't get through)
_/
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
