Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:34:21 +0100 From: Patrice Riemens <[email protected]>
Rens wrote: Bah, Bah en Bah, This is some sloppy writing. Mario observes: I agree. For you to introduce yourself to us with incoherent sounds, is beyond sloppy:-)) Rens wrote: First of all there is nothing wrong with a bit of socialism but in the US context that is not the case. Socialism US style has very often to do with lobbyists and is thus not socialist at all. Mario observes: Isn't it intellectually lazy to obsess about "lobbyists", who have no vote, and not the stupid politicians, who do? That's "The devil made me do it" defense. Sounds good, but makes no sense. Rens wrote: With the exception of socialized medicine, in my humble opinion a basic human right,... Mario asks: Why stop at socialized medicine? How about other basic rights like food and shelter and clothing? Why not the right to not be poor? Hey, didn't we go through all this with Karl Marx, and look what happened to his ridiculous theories - everyone who tried them have dumped them. Rens wrote: ...it has been proven that the so called free market of lobbyists does not work and the tax dollars at least have not resulted in government bodies that do what they are supposed to do: regulate. Mario responds: Actually, it all worked pretty well, until the government and its regulators got involved. Perhaps your body of knowledge has missed the fact that the current financial mess in the US was caused by government regulation The politicians, not any lobbyist, passed a law in 1977 called the Community Reinvestment Act, which had as its socialist-style goal home ownership by low income Americans, who normally rent their houses. Initially, this law remained dormant, which showed how silly it was. During the Clinton administration, the government threatened the banks with lawsuits and regulatory consequences if they did not meet the quotas in this law, which they could only do by lowering credit standards. This was socialism at the expense of capitalism, because the banking system functioned fine until then, but began to get progressively weaker thereafter as the risky loans escalated. Quasi-government organizations like Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, encouraged by the left leaning politicians, began to buy these risky loans bundled into risky investment vehicles which was like buying manure packaged in gift boxes. The banks then joined in with fundamentally flawed lending practices like sub prime loans, interest only loans, no-downpayment loans, etc. and the bankers made huge bonuses from the growth in their business. Since you folks like a little humor, listen to this explanation of how this all worked, with a lot of truth behind the humor: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R-o-bdH_S4&feature=related The risky lending led to a bubble in housing prices. When the economy slowed down in 2008 after seven years of growth as our economic cycles always do, people were unable to make their payments, property values began to drop, and the entire house of cards came tumbling down. All because of government regulation. Rens wrote: However if the people in Washington had balls they would truly nationalize the financial system instead of dumping tons of good future tax income at bad assets and then giving it away to the private sector to have others profit from it. Mario responds: How would nationalizing the system and having politicians run the system be any better than throwing money at bankers and making them fix the problem and repaying the money - which is the theory - given that it was politicians who caused the problem in the first place? The banking system worked fine until the politicians got involved. Rens wrote: On taxes: what do you get for your US taxes compared to say any other nation with high taxes? ...a military that is focused on securing the nations territory only, Mario responds: Aren't your taxes higher than ours? Securing your territory? Now you are really being funny! You would be speaking German right now, or perhaps Russian, if our taxes did not underwrite your puny security. Rens wrote: The US tax system is a mess. If you buy a nice home you pay your ass off in taxes just for the pleasure of having a home. Mario responds: Rens, you really need to get a grip. I can only laugh so much in one day:-)) Actually, our property taxes pay for a lot more than pleasure. Besides, I just went out and checked, and my township's roads and bridges, water and sanitation systems, public schools and parks, police and fire departments were all in fine shape, thanks to my property taxes. Rens wrote: In China you pay a top tier of 40% income tax, that's it. Nothing more. Mario responds: Yes, I have to agree with you here. China is definitely the model for the rest of us to strive for:-)) I guess this is why there are millions of people risking their lives to get into China any way they can:-)) Quoting the irrepressible Ronald Reagan, who helped the old Soviet Union, the ultimate example of extreme socialism, implode, "The scariest words in the English language are 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help you'." Oh, here's another one from Reagan, "A communist is someone who reads Marx. An anti-communist is someone who understands Marx." Perhaps you can translate these into Dutch and have a laugh with your friends. After all, Reagan is the one who played a principle role in getting the Russian bear off your backs so that you can focus on defending yourselves only from fierce immigrants:-))
