ha ha! yes indeed. i was counting intermediaries, so off by one. wirth was on robert's thesis committee. (A Programming Language for Vector Computers, his auto vectorizing Oberon subset for the Cray-YMP.)
On Tue, Feb 5, 2019 at 10:55 AM Jan Mercl <0xj...@gmail.com> wrote: > Just an of-by-one error. After all, Michael is also a programmer ;-) > > On Tue, Feb 5, 2019, 19:51 Dan Kortschak <d...@kortschak.io> wrote: > >> Robert Griesamer *is* Niklaus Wirth? >> >> On Tue, 2019-02-05 at 09:19 -0800, Michael Jones wrote: >> > Go learns from Oberon via Go and Oberon insider Robert Griesemer, >> > whose >> > Wirth-number is zero. >> > >> > On Tue, Feb 5, 2019 at 3:47 AM Gerard <gvdsch...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > > >> > > Hello everyone. There has been one issue in Go that has never >> > > gotten out >> > > of my head, so it went on and on. The problem is modules. >> > > >> > > In the beginning there was Oberon. Let's just face it. Oberon was a >> > > brilliant designed piece of engineering. Oberon did have some >> > > marvelous >> > > features that just don't exist today, such as GC for everything, >> > > including >> > > closing files (anyone ever seen that), and their memory system was >> > > also GC, >> > > including modules entirely. So they made a counter for each module >> > > that was >> > > being used. You add one, the counter increase. You lose one, the >> > > counter >> > > went down and when that counter went zero that module got erased >> > > from >> > > memory. Pretty clever. >> > > >> > > Oberon also got very small compiled modules. They were compiled and >> > > the >> > > API was being check-summed. And they didn't got generics ;-) There >> > > was no >> > > need for that since the basic types were so simple, a lot simpler >> > > than in >> > > Go. >> > > >> > > Why were they using this compiled API file? That was only used for >> > > identification. Everything that has public code goes into the >> > > compiled >> > > header file. There is AFAIK no no linking. The only thing that is >> > > being >> > > used are the compiled modules and compiled header files. >> > > >> > > Now I have explained everything that I know that I know about >> > > modules. >> > > What are the areas of interest? The only answer that I can find out >> > > is OS >> > > design. But for that the benefits are huge, but only if you have >> > > the guts >> > > to really gutter the whole thing down. >> > > >> > > What compiles: >> > > That is pretty easy. Everything that is public will be part of a >> > > header >> > > file, the rest stays inside the module itself. >> > > >> > > The benefits: >> > > >> > > 1. This maps a lot better for OS development. >> > > 2. No linking involved. >> > > 3. updates could have been "on the fly", with just a couple of >> > > LOC you >> > > can download and compile an entire module, as long as the API >> > > hasn't >> > > changed. >> > > 4. Fit well with systems such as apt-get, GNU GUIX, but also go >> > > get. >> > > >> > > >> > > The downsides: >> > > >> > > 1. This could confuse people who tend to use it. How can you use >> > > it? >> > > That is why I think that this could probably only work for OS >> > > design. You >> > > just don't want to download a half baked module. >> > > 2. It could have been used proprietary. Personally I have a lot >> > > against proprietary code. >> > > >> > > >> > > Questions: >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Links: >> > > >> > > 1. http://members.home.nl/jmr272/Oberon/ModToOberon.pdf >> > > 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oberon_(programming_language) >> > > 3. http://www.ethoberon.ethz.ch/WirthPubl/ProgInOberon.pdf >> > > >> > > >> > > -- >> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > > Groups >> > > "golang-nuts" group. >> > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >> > > send an >> > > email to golang-nuts+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> > > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > *Michael T. jonesmichael.jo...@gmail.com <michael.jo...@gmail.com>* >> > >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "golang-nuts" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to golang-nuts+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > -- > > -j > -- *Michael T. jonesmichael.jo...@gmail.com <michael.jo...@gmail.com>* -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "golang-nuts" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to golang-nuts+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
