Hear! Hear! On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 10:37 AM, Augusto de Ornellas Abreu < [email protected]> wrote:
> Come on, don't be like that! > > NO ONE here discouraged building, we just told the ORIGINAL poster that > his perspective of building himself a gurdy for less than a very affordable > kit, with enough profit margin to sell it for 1200 was not a realistic goal > to have. > > People on my side of the discussion made the point (with actual figures to > support it) that one should build for the fun and personal satisfaction > behind the endeavour, but not to get his hands on a cheap instrument. HG > makers do NOT work with a wide enough margin to make it self-evident and > certain that anyone with some tools and some woodworking experience would > be able to - in his first attempt - make himself an actual working gurdy > (and not a HGLO) for much less that someone with a fully equipped shop, all > jigs and molds already properly made and spare parts already made and > fitted (bushings, bearings, tangents, etc). > > What there is no place here for is this kind of immaturity that interprets > a very good discussion with great points being made on BOTH sides of the > argument and twists it immensely, taking it personally and distorting the > whole point. > > > On Mon, Oct 31, 2011 at 12:48 PM, timw <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Description The general subject of the list is hurdy-gurdies: their >> music, players, maintenance, recordings, events, construction, and >> anything else that seems pertinant. We welcome discussion of all >> aspects of the instrument. >> >> This group seems to delight in not supporting construction, but rather >> discourage it. I am the obvious newcomer here and this hasn't been a >> welcoming group. >> >> You can sigh comfortably, this is my final post. Tim, newcomer and >> amateur luthier. >> >> On Oct 30, 9:52 pm, Felicia Dale <[email protected]> wrote: >> > Well said, Leonard. >> > >> > Felicia. >> > >> > On Oct 29, 2011, at 11:16 AM, Leonard Williams wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> > > I built my own hurdy gurdy after years of longing to own one >> > > without the means of purchase. I had some experience with >> > > woodworking, some good tools (power and hand), and very good plans >> > > for an early renaissance model purchased from a professional >> > > builder. Because of the bizarre grain of the wood I had (American >> > > elm), I had trouble finding someone willing to surface the wood (a >> > > rough plank) to my dimensions; I had to rough it on a table saw and >> > > get final thicknesses with a hand plane and scrapers. With some >> > > patient telephone coaching from the designer of the instrument I was >> > > able build a simple (no trompette, single chanter, 3 drone) hurdy >> > > gurdy. Howerever, it was a number of years before I finally got the >> > > “finished” instrument set up satisfactorily (This forum was a great >> > > help in the final stages!). >> > > I am no longer sure of the material costs, but it was far >> > > less than a professionally built instrument. I am proud of the >> > > result of my labors, and builcing my gurdy fulfilled a desperate >> > > need. BUT—would I do it again? I think not—I’d try to save up and >> > > buy one from a craftsman/artist who knows what he’s doing. This is >> > > certainly not intended to discourage anyone from trying to build a >> > > hurdy gurdy or any instrument on his own—by all means try it if you >> > > really want to! I learned a lot from the experience and do not >> > > regret it—just be aware that it requires a good deal of patience. >> > > There is an element to instrument building that is purely >> > > mechanical, but every collection of wooden parts is an organic >> > > entity which requires its own peculiar tweaking to become a musical >> > > instrument. >> > >> > > Regards, >> > > Leonard Williams >> > > _ >> > > [: :] >> > > / | | \ >> > > | | | | >> > > (_==_) >> > > !~¿ >> > >> > > On 10/26/11 4:46 PM, "Steven Tucker" <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> > >> Ulrich, why would want this discussion to stop? It's getting >> > >> really interesting. There is considerable knowledge and talent >> > >> here on this forum and I think the subject of "Affordable Hurdy >> > >> Gurdy Construction" is worth delving into. I guess I'm assuming >> > >> that someone who is looking into building their own gurdy will >> > >> search this forum and discover this thread an so it's appropriate >> > >> to discuss the costs and ramifications of attempting to build one >> > >> from scratch within a budget. >> > >> > >> On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 7:25 AM, Kazimierz Verkmastare >> > >> <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >>> Alden, I hope you don't mind me using you for an example. >> > >> > >>> Steve, will you agree with this statement - "If what you want is >> > >>> an Olympic Chinook, then you shouldn't expect, unless you are Cali >> > >>> and Alden, to be able to build one for less than they do. They >> > >>> have streamlined production and amortized costs, and probably >> > >>> can't lower costs (materials + labor + tools) further." >> > >> > >> I would actually say that if what you want is an Olympic Chinook >> > >> then you shouldn't expect to be able to build one at all unless >> > >> you're Cali and Alden. Now if you were an experienced luthier and >> > >> had an actual Olympic Chinook in front of you, and were experienced >> > >> and proficient at top voicing, then you might expect to be able to >> > >> make a reasonably good copy, but not for less than they do. >> > >> > >>> So say you want a Chinook, if you are as skilled and >> > >>> knowledgable as the Hackmans, you can build yourself one for >> > >>> probably $1700 or $1800, real cost. (Don't remove labor cost from >> > >>> the equation - your time is worth it). >> > >> > >> I agree with almost everything you've been saying except the part >> > >> about counting labor time as real cost. Now this is true if we're >> > >> talking about someone who is thinking about going into business of >> > >> making hurdy gurdies to sell, but if I want to spend my unpaid time >> > >> on learning about and building a hurdy gurdy, and don't buy premium >> > >> AAAA luthierie woods, then my total cash outlay for a Chinook-like >> > >> hurdy gurdy would be around $300 or less -- even accounting for >> > >> precision bushings and a shaft from McMaster Carr and a AA spruce >> > >> top from Luthier's Mercantile. >> > >> > >> The expensive exotic hardwoods and highly figured woods that >> > >> luthiers use in their instruments don't have anything to do with >> > >> the sound quality or stability of the instrument. ( I could launch >> > >> into a huge discussion proving this statement, but it's already >> > >> been hashed out quite thoroughly in many forums and technical >> > >> papers.) Beautiful wood is an artistic choice. >> > >> > >> [...] >> > >> > >>> Tools? You don't need tools. A pocketknife, a piece of broken >> > >>> window glass, a hacksaw blade nailed to a bent willow twig, a >> > >>> carpenter's pencil and a leather punch, that's all you need, >> > >>> right? No. >> > >> > >> I would contend that all you need is a bow saw with a thin blade >> > >> and a thick blade, a luthier's knife (made from an old file), a >> > >> steel scraper, a drill, and possibly a wood carvers gouge. >> > >> (Assuming you buy the shaft, bushings, and top wood). >> > >> [...] >> > >> > >>> [...] But a player who wants a good instrument but can't afford >> > >>> one and has little woodworking skills does not stand a great >> > >>> chance of success in building a great gurdy fast and with only a >> > >>> couple of hundred bucks to throw at the project. And those are >> > >>> the folks we address here. >> > >> > >> A few years back, at a music camp, I met a very excellent gurdy >> > >> player who had built his own. It had a great sound, easily >> > >> comparable to the $5000 range instruments also at camp. It was the >> > >> first instrument he ever built (he was about 24 years old), and he >> > >> made it using only hand tools and a power drill in his apartment >> > >> living room. The body was a converted $10 classical guitar, the >> > >> shaft and bearings were wood, and the wheel was made from a scrap >> > >> of Baltic Birch plywood. It was quite fascinating to watch the >> > >> "nose in the air" disdain from other gurdy players turn to >> > >> mortification when they realized that this disreputable looking >> > >> instrument made their very expensive showpiece sound like a thinly >> > >> wailing rodent. (their words, not mine, said in good jest I'm sure.) >> > >> This kid wasn't a genius, didn't come from a professional >> > >> woodworking family, had only had the experience of playing on a >> > >> friends gurdy "a few times". He told me it took him about two >> > >> weeks of evenings to put together and the hardest part was cutting >> > >> the key guides and getting the dog to buzz right. >> > >> > >> -S >> > >> > > -- >> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > > Groups "hurdygurdy" group. >> > > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> > > [email protected] >> > > For more options, visit this group at >> > >http://groups.google.com/group/hurdygurdy >> > >> > > The rules of posting, courtesy, and other list information may be >> > > found athttp://hurdygurdy.com/mailinglist/index.htm. To reduce >> > > spam, posts from new subscribers are held pending approval by the >> > > webmaster. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "hurdygurdy" group. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> [email protected] >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/hurdygurdy >> >> The rules of posting, courtesy, and other list information may be found >> at http://hurdygurdy.com/mailinglist/index.htm. To reduce spam, posts >> from new subscribers are held pending approval by the webmaster. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "hurdygurdy" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [email protected] > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/hurdygurdy > > The rules of posting, courtesy, and other list information may be found at > http://hurdygurdy.com/mailinglist/index.htm. To reduce spam, posts from > new subscribers are held pending approval by the webmaster. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "hurdygurdy" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hurdygurdy The rules of posting, courtesy, and other list information may be found at http://hurdygurdy.com/mailinglist/index.htm. To reduce spam, posts from new subscribers are held pending approval by the webmaster.
