I am writing this incase anyone else is having the same trouble following this thread as me. We are talking about the Calculate activity. If you hover over Sin-1 the delayed help popup is Arc Sine. Like Edward, I did not notice a second delayed pop up "help".
Click on that and help(asin) is displayed in the calculator display window. Press enter and the help is displayed on the right. This is your cue that you can type any valid string into the calculator display window and execute it. You are not confined to pressing buttons. Type help(index) and a list of topics is displayed to the right but appears to be truncated. The full string is also in the calculator display window if you scroll left or right. >From there its a small step to try help(plot) though getting the syntax right >for =plot(eqn, var=-a..b) was not easy for me and I had to refer to the posts >to get the syntax right Then plot(sin(x),x=0..360) and yes, a nice plot is displayed to the right. I tried this out yesterday but despite having read all the posts, I could make no sense of it. It was only when I read of the second delayed help that I could make any sense. So even when you know what you are looking for, finding it is not that easy. > On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 8:25 PM, Gary C Martin <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > On 11 Dec 2008, at 00:24, Edward Cherlin wrote: > > > >> On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 2:51 PM, Reinier Heeres <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > >>> Hi, > >>> > >>> I agree that the plotting functionality is not really well exposed, > >>> although help(index) will show you it's available and help(plot) will > >>> tell you how to use it. Try plot(sin(x),x=0..360) for example. I'll work > >>> on the exposure of plotting in the next release; suggestions on how to > >>> do this exactly would be welcome. > >> > >> Just exposing help would go a long way to solving the problem. > > > > Help is already exposed in the hover menu for each toolbar icon. Not > > discoverable enough? > > Absolutely not enough. I have to wait for the menu to expand _twice_. > How was I supposed to discover that? > > > Seems Reinier' s Calculate has much more effort/detail > > put in than any other activity so far. > > That doesn't mean that he got it right. I really, really hate delayed > hover menus, and I hate doubly-delayed hover menus many times more. > First, because they are inherently not discoverable, and secondly, > because you are wasting my time, and every other user's time. I reject > the argument that we are trying to teach children to click icons > directly, and note that it doesn't even apply in the case of help. > > My general principle of UI design is, never, ever try to be smarter > than your user. Not even if you are. Now that I know that help is on > the menus on double delay, I will almost never use it that way, > because typing is faster, but I will resent it every time I have to > type it, because the menu could be faster. > > > --Gary > > > >>> The implementation is as basic as it can get: it evaluates an expression > >>> at 100 points between the start and stop range. The internal parser is a > >>> bit slow, but it's pure python and works reasonably well. > >>> > >>> With a bit of coding we could surely add some functionality to get data > >>> from Measure in there too. > >>> > >>> I am not inclined to add RPN parsing myself, but patches will of course > >>> be considered. > >> > >> Would you look at http://sourceforge.net/projects/calcrpnpy/ and tell > >> me what you need done to it? > >> > >>> Regards, > >>> Reinier > >>> > >>> Edward Cherlin wrote: > >>>> > >>>> On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 11:18 AM, Gary C Martin <[email protected]> > >>>> wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> On 10 Dec 2008, at 18:41, Walter Bender wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>> I haven't looked at it in a while, but what plotting engine is built > >>>>>> inside of the Calculator Activity? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -walter > >>>>>> > >>>>> I think Reinier wrote his own little svg plot generator class called > >>>>> plotlib.py. > >>>>> > >>>>> --Gary > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> I didn't know about the plotting capability, which will have endless > >>>> uses. It is certainly not discoverable. > >>>> > >>>> Can we feed a segment of a data stream from Measure to Calculate as a > >>>> named function? > >>>> > >>>> Why don't we put something like plot(f(x),x=min..max) on the toolbar? > >>>> Can we provide hints about the functions and syntax anywhere in the > >>>> UI? Is there a way to recall and edit an input line? Are there other > >>>> functions not exposed in the UI? > >>>> > >>>> I have a fairly old book called Numerical Analysis on the Pocket > >>>> Calculator, which explains how to do all sorts of things that you > >>>> might not expect on even the simplest 4- and 5-function devices, and > >>>> works on up through the sort of algebraic calculator we have here to > >>>> the programmable calculator. Our users will need something like this, > >>>> to take maximum advantage of the seemingly limited capabilities we are > >>>> offering them. > >>>> > >>>> And can we have an RPN mode? I can't tell you how much most real > >>>> engineers hate parentheses. We are not doing children any favors by > >>>> hiding the more advanced tools. > >>>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Reinier Heeres > >>> Waalstraat 17 > >>> 2515 XK Den Haag > >>> The Netherlands > >>> > >>> Tel: +31 6 10852639 > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) > >>> [email protected] > >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Silent Thunder > >> (é»é·/धरà¥à¤®à¤®à¥à¤à¤¶à¤¬à¥à¤¦à¤à¤°à¥à¤/دھر٠٠Ûگھشبدگر > >> ج) is my name > >> And Children are my nation. > >> The Cosmos is my dwelling place, The Truth my destination. > >> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/User:Mokurai > >> _______________________________________________ > >> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) > >> [email protected] > >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep > > > > > > > > -- > Silent Thunder > (é»é·/धरà¥à¤®à¤®à¥à¤à¤¶à¤¬à¥à¤¦à¤à¤°à¥à¤/دھر٠٠Ûگھشبدگر > ج) is my name > And Children are my nation. > The Cosmos is my dwelling place, The Truth my destination. > http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/User:Mokurai > _______________________________________________ > IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) > [email protected] > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep > > _____________________________________________________ > This mail has been virus scanned by Australia On Line > see http://www.australiaonline.net.au/mailscanning
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