On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 09:03:34 -0800, Gerhard Adam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>Well, we support it for our students, plus the central Scholastic >Alliance hub. It's what we do. Don't know what your employer does, but >that's what we >do, and it's part of my job description. Do we offer >every option? No, but we support 99% of what people want for the >Scholastic Alliance. We supported >>the recent Mainframe Programming contest, supporting lots of students >in parts 1 & 2 as TSO users on the hub. Non-technical issues prevented >us from >>supporting part 3, which was separate z/OS systems for a couple hundred >students. > >>Interesting questions that all need answers, but ones we've been >dealing with for many years. We offer students here Linux servers that >they can >>completely destroy. Different operating system, but the issues aren't >that different. > >My comments were aimed at the point which suggested that IBM simply make >z/OS available over the internet for anyone that wanted to use it. In >your case, you're obviously supporting a finite set of students. For the >IBM Academic Initiative the IBM site indicates that there were only 380 >student accounts for 2004-2005. It's about twice that now. Yes, still a small number. Find more schools that want to teach z/OS, and we'll add them on. It's a problem we'd love to have. No schools teaching z/OS means limited supply of new programmers, and then it'll become your employer's problem. > Even at the highest levels of use, this >wouldn't compare to national or potentially world-wide access >considerations. Put some numbers on the table, and not just SWAGs, but real numbers backed up by some research. It's probably a 4 digit number at most. >Also offering Linux servers is not the same thing as >offering a comparable number of z/OS servers; its apples and oranges at >a variety of levels. It's not apples and oranges at all. It's a size issue. Conceptually they are similar. We've done similar things for z/VM and we've looked at doing similar things for z/OS. > >In addition, the point was made regarding people using the systems to >develop fixes and software which is not related to introducing new >users. In effect, if the purpose is to simply allow new user access to >gain knowledge, then that represents one set of problems and standards >that would need to be maintained. On the other hand, if it is expected >that these systems provide the integrity and support necessary to allow >the development of software and other ongoing activities then their >level of support becomes correspondingly higher. True, but they are all steps along a continuum. Issues to solve one will be useful and learning tools for the other. > >I'm also not suggesting that it can't be done, but rather that it >involves significantly more effort than simply providing a z/900 and >several MVS images under VM. I agree. As I've said, we've looked at some of the issues for projects we are working on now. But these problems are not insurmountable. If it is something important to you/your employer, you need to make your views known through requirements type processes. If not, then we're just a bunch of techies talking about how pretty the handle on the buggy whip is. > >Please note that my comments are aimed at the concept of "MVS >knowledge". If the only purpose is to provide a platform for >programming, then that's an entirely different venture and is much more >readily achievable. I'll leave it to you and others to figure out what you want. Just remember that the bigger the ocean, the harder it is to boil, and starting small and building on success gets more people excited. That's how the Scholastic Alliance has steadily grown over time. > >Adam > /ahw ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
