On 07.07.2022 17:45, David Crayford wrote:
On 7/07/2022 7:53 pm, Rony G. Flatscher wrote:
On 06.07.2022 11:03, Seymour J Metz wrote:
... cut ...
There is one ecosystem that beats Perl, Python and practically any others: Java. For every
problem domain, for new emerging technologies there are Java class libraries which one can take
advantage of. As Java classes get compiled to intermediate byte code, these Java class libraries
can be deployed and used immediately on any hardware and any operating system for which a Java
virtual machine exists.
That's debatable! I'm a full time Java programmer in the last few years and I like. We use Spring
Boot which is a high quality framework that makes it pleasant to use. I would use SB even for a
slightly complex command line interface. However, the build systems are a bit spotty compared to
Node.js, Python etc.
Eclipse, NetBeans, IntelliJ, ...
Maven is creaking with it's ugly XML pom.xml and
Beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder ...
Maven is not Java and still an incredible boon!
Gradle doesn't work very well on some systems.
What does not work for you?
Would you think that the Java multiplatform build system which is done with Gradle would be
possible, if that were true what you say?
C# is a far better language then Java.
Excuse me? 😂
When Microsoft lost their lawsuit against Sun about not adhering to the signed Java license
(remember J#?) which stated among other things that Microsoft was not allowed to create Java classes
such that they become dependent on the Microsoft operating system (a lock-in strategy and attempting
to harm Java's "write once, run anywhere" goal), Microsoft started with an alternative to Java and
eventually came up with .Net/CLR and C# (later F#, VB.Net and the like).
I don't use it because I because I'm not a Windows guy but I look on in envy.
If you were to do that for no obvious reasons other that you personally "like it", it would be a
move to get into a Microsoft lock-in without a need.
Java has been the break-free-from-lock-ins alternative for decades. Java allows you to run your
applications on Windows, but also on MacOS or Linux or ...
Kotlin meets 95% of the requirements but we dismissed it because it's not mainstream so we're
stuck with Java.
Poor you! ;)
(You got stuck in one of the most up-to-date and maintained languages and environments that sets you
free from being locked-in in a specific platform.)
I was surprised to notice when I followed Timothy's link to the TIOBE index that C++ is about to
leapfrog Java. https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/. The article cites rapid standard rollouts and
ground breaking new features such as co-routines. As a Lua fan I can't for C++ co-routines. On
TIOBE Lua has raced back into the top 20 which is due to the surging popularity of gaming
frameworks such as Roblox.
So you follow the mainstream and when the set of currently reported popular languages changes, you
change the language because of it and bad-mouth any other language?
You do not choose the language depending on the problem and
environment/infrastructure at hand to solve?
... cut ...
The Java runtime environment (JRE) already comes with a wealth of professional and tested class
libraries covering practically all aspects of modern programming, covering everything that any
modern application may have a need to exploit and interact with.
Yes. But you need to use Open Source libraries for it to be easy to use. The
JRE doesn't cut it.
Hmm?
The JRE includes a wealth of functionality, a wealth of packages that in other languages are only
available as add-ons.
Seeing the OpenJDK (open-source Java) community and how vigorously Java gets developed further,
continually updated in critical areas like security, there is no end in sight for this great
ecosystem. Witnessing also OpenJDK distributions (from Java 8 LTS to the latest Java 18) from
IBM, Amazon, SAP, even Microsoft, and many, many more competent and leading IT-related companies,
the support for Java is unique compared to any other software there is.
One of the reasons for the surge in C++ is because Java is flabby.
Flabby? 😎
ROTFL
It's uses a huge amount of memory and GC is costly in visualized environments.
That is just not true as many of the other statements. You seem to not really have followed the huge
work and improvements over the decades and the state.
(Though your statement may be true for C# and .Net/CLR. ;) )
GraalVM is a valiant attempt to solve that problem.
Nope. The scope is different and interesting (trying to have a common interface standard for
various, specific languages among them C and C++, which you might faultily take as a weak sign of C
and C++?).
Anyway, your statements at times seem to be directed ad bad mouthing technologies even if they are
unsubstantiated, maybe for igniting flames or creating false - emotional - impressions? In any case
bad-mouthing has been an important part of FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubts) marketing in the past
decades (thinking e.g. of mainframes, COBOL, OS/2 and the like) and is something you surely can do
without I am sure.
---rony
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